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[Music]

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mike lucas

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broadcasting live from the nice nice 66

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degree iron studio here in wisconsin

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welcome to paying radio tonight is

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sunday july 23rd 2017 we have a treat

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for you tonight we have the man himself

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stan friedman coming on in just a few

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minutes he's standing by in very cool

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canada and it was actually cooler back

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here by lake superior tonight but i'm

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with my co-host ken storage uh ken ken

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booked this show for us and i i

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appreciate it ken thanks for reaching

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out to stan it was great for for you to

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do that oh i i'm excited about having mr

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freeman on tonight and um yeah looking

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forward to tonight's show should be

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interesting and kenny do you got any

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shout outs tonight i do i want to have a

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shout out to kevin berry i know he's

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tuned in and uh laura hunter and george

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and patty in

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springfield missouri and dick in

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maryland and

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rosie over in england rosie thanks for

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joining us tonight well that that's

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quite a long list and i'd like to thank

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all my facebook friends who have been

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downloading our app like crazy to uh you

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know listen to the voice of the fringe

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majority and there's many different ways

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to listen to iron you can listen via

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our chat download inception radio

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network mobile you can listen to us on i

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heart radio now and we'll be going live

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very soon on i heart radio plus our

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podcast we're on tune in radio stitcher

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radio roku

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you can listen to us anywhere um most

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cars are equipped with android operating

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systems download ir in on that car

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listen to us and if you don't have a

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smartphone for all you people out there

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that

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still use flip phones which there are

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some people you got 401

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6700 you can listen to us on your

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speakerphone you don't need internet to

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listen to iron you can call up and

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listen on a speakerphone so kenny many

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ways to listen

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yeah absolutely he can't there's no

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excuses no excuses at all and and

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tonight i'm privileged um i've been

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watching him for for quite a long time

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i'm sure ken has too he is uh he's a

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legend himself and me and ken were

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talking before the show he's more like

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an elvis

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to us uh the king of ufology research

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he's he's he's done it all roswell mj12

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be sure you get your questions ready in

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chat but uh we'd like to introduce stan

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friedman stan it is ultimate pleasure to

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have you on your show thanks for coming

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on tonight

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i'm delighted to be on from beautiful

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downtown fredericton new brunswick

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canada 73 miles east of beautiful

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downtown houghton maine so i share two

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countries

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[Laughter]

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you're a dual citizen

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that's right i've got two passports

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outstanding

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[Laughter]

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good for you

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oh man hey well won't we just uh go

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ahead and uh jump right in the middle of

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it what do you say i'm jay yeah go ahead

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ken i'm gonna hand it over to you you

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did the pleasure of booking uh mr mr

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stan here yeah you know uh mr friedman i

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you know i want to tell everybody i'm uh

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uh i read

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all of your uh articles in the mufon

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magazine uh perceptions

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yeah good yeah yeah and i uh i truly

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enjoy some of your comments and i

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appreciate your humor too so

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uh i know that sometimes it goes over

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like a lead balloon in the ufology with

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some people being um

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a little sensitive you mean huh yeah a

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little thin skin uh you know we had uh

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kevin randall on a couple of weeks ago

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and he got i mentioned your name and he

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well and and uh you know uh we

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we were referring to his uh latest book

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roswell in the 21st century

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and uh

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he got yeah he was a little testy um i'm

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not sure exactly why other than it may

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be uh a jealousy factor i don't know i

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mean i respect kevin randle don't make

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any mistake about that but

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he's written more than 80 books so i got

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to respect anybody who can do that but

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well i have yet to write one i don't

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know

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get around to it but

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i haven't written any fiction yet i've

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written them

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my name is on six non-fiction books but

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at least i hope to non-fiction

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well no and

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you know mj and i were talking excuse me

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prior to the show

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and it's true you

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um you

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i think this is my opinion but i think

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you broke the whole topic

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of ufology wide open uh with your

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interview of uh

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major marcel and exposing uh roswell

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and i think

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that all the hardcore skeptics that are

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tuned in and listening

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that if they could any way shape

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would

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overturn

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the perception of roswell they'd find

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one piece of excuse me evidence

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that would

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basically

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uh turn the light out on ufology because

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i think roswell is the keystone i i've

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said that on on

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a number of occasions

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of ufology if you can

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show that

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you know that roswell was nothing more

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than a balloon

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uh

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or

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we brought back from europe then

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you know the whole well

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you know it's kind of funny i read my

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first the first book i read about ufos

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way back in 1958

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and uh

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i didn't hear about roswell really until

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the 70s so i was active as

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in ufology uh starting pretty early

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and uh

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roswell wasn't part of the picture i

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didn't know anything about roswell until

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i

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up and

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everything else changed but uh

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you know uh as as a nuclear physicist

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i'm concerned about facts and data and

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solid information and uh

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uh and you know that

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in a sense the difference between kevin

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and me is that i have never written any

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fiction

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uh well

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yeah and i i think that uh you are a

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avid researcher uh you obviously have a

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eye for detail i uh like i said i enjoy

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reading uh in the in the perceptions

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when you comment you seem to always back

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it up

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uh with information where an individual

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can go and look it up for themselves

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well that's what i tried to do have

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facts in hand before putting mouth and

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gear is my rule

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oh yeah my mom would say sometimes the

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only time i open my mouth is to change

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feet

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you know but that's a good line i like

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that yeah yeah and and so

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you know the the fact that uh you seem

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to be able to back it up

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and i i noticed that a lot of your

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critics uh really don't respond when

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when you

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present

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uh facts and figures to them

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uh in in the you know on the topic they

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they

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seem to be armchair quarterbacks

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and don't really uh do the research and

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and make all kinds of accusations but

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they don't have anything to back it up

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and what they do they only they cherry

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pick they don't give you the whole the

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whole picture at least that's my

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interpretation that's how i see it i i

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think you're right and i

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this is too important a subject to leave

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it to

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fictionalizing and to hoping and wishing

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uh

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you know

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i've been at this a long time

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and i'm like i say reading the first

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book in 1958

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and

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i have lived with uh

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ufology for a long time

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and what i find is that uh people

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have difficulty understanding that you

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should get the facts in hand first i've

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been to 20 archives for example i love

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archives somebody pay me i'd spend all

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my time in our lives but

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yeah

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well you know it goes with the story of

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being a scientist uh

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it isn't enough to have an idea it isn't

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enough to want to believe something is

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true

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and you know

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the the big noises in ufology have been

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people well philip class uh

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fine writer we've senior avionics editor

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for aviation week in space technology

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but

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uh he

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he started with the proposition all

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sightings can be explained

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and it doesn't matter if you get your

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facts right because

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they

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explanations

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and i i get a great laugh at my lectures

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when i show a copy of a check he had to

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write me

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for proving him wrong flat out dead

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wrong

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about some mj12 document

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uh and you know it illustrates the

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problem he uh challenged me

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this is a brief memo which

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uh was exciting it's a memo from bobby

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cutler ike's national security advisor

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uh

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and

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bill said uh well

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the memo is obviously a fraud because

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it's done in the large

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fica type but the national security

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council whose name is on the top only

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use a leap type and i've got nine

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documents to prove it he sent copies of

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the nine and he challenged me

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to find any genuine documents done on

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the same size and style type you'd think

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he knew what he was talking about

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wouldn't you

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and so

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he offered me a hundred dollars each

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i'll pay you 100 each up to a maximum of

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10

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and he gave all the criteria that it had

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to meet requirements and so forth

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and uh

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i first thing i did was look at my files

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and i had more than 20 documents done

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from the national security council

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in

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psychotype but they didn't meet all his

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criteria only two did

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uh

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so i know i was going to the eisenhower

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library so i went there uh

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i live on the east coast eisenhower

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libraries in the middle of the country

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you know

284
00:11:20,710 --> 00:11:17,839
minutes in a car to get there

285
00:11:24,069 --> 00:11:20,720
anyway i went there i dug out 14

286
00:11:25,910 --> 00:11:24,079
documents that met all his criteria

287
00:11:27,590 --> 00:11:25,920
made copies

288
00:11:29,910 --> 00:11:27,600
sent him an invoice for a thousand

289
00:11:31,269 --> 00:11:29,920
dollars he said a maximum of 10 that he

290
00:11:33,350 --> 00:11:31,279
would pay for

291
00:11:35,829 --> 00:11:33,360
and he paid me and then he got mattered

292
00:11:39,030 --> 00:11:35,839
heck when i published a copy of his

293
00:11:43,509 --> 00:11:41,190
but rightly so

294
00:11:45,030 --> 00:11:43,519
and you know the funny thing is i hadn't

295
00:11:46,550 --> 00:11:45,040
didn't find this out until a little

296
00:11:49,190 --> 00:11:46,560
later

297
00:11:51,910 --> 00:11:49,200
uh because i know phil isn't stupid uh

298
00:11:53,590 --> 00:11:51,920
how could he be so far off i i found out

299
00:11:56,630 --> 00:11:53,600
he'd never been to the eisenhower

300
00:11:58,550 --> 00:11:56,640
library i spent weeks there

301
00:12:00,550 --> 00:11:58,560
uh you know how could he make a

302
00:12:03,590 --> 00:12:00,560
challenge like that

303
00:12:06,150 --> 00:12:03,600
without having any any facts in hand

304
00:12:08,629 --> 00:12:06,160
oh he was fine

305
00:12:10,949 --> 00:12:08,639
yeah and as another example of thing you

306
00:12:13,590 --> 00:12:10,959
got to watch out for in this field

307
00:12:15,910 --> 00:12:13,600
one of the other big debunkers actually

308
00:12:18,230 --> 00:12:15,920
preceding class because he was older

309
00:12:21,190 --> 00:12:18,240
was dr donald howard menzel harvard

310
00:12:24,629 --> 00:12:21,200
university professor of astronomy

311
00:12:27,110 --> 00:12:24,639
he wrote three anti-ufo books

312
00:12:28,710 --> 00:12:27,120
and i couldn't understand i had one run

313
00:12:30,310 --> 00:12:28,720
in with him

314
00:12:31,110 --> 00:12:30,320
uh

315
00:12:33,190 --> 00:12:31,120
and

316
00:12:35,110 --> 00:12:33,200
it wasn't friendly

317
00:12:38,470 --> 00:12:35,120
and i didn't understand what the heck

318
00:12:41,190 --> 00:12:38,480
was going on because he was too smart to

319
00:12:42,470 --> 00:12:41,200
have done all this accidentally so to

320
00:12:46,470 --> 00:12:42,480
speak

321
00:12:49,350 --> 00:12:46,480
and then i found a mention of a legal

322
00:12:51,670 --> 00:12:49,360
situation and somebody else's papers is

323
00:12:53,670 --> 00:12:51,680
about the mj-12 stuff

324
00:12:56,629 --> 00:12:53,680
and

325
00:13:00,949 --> 00:12:58,710
dr menzel

326
00:13:03,590 --> 00:13:00,959
and it was a letter from a lawyer

327
00:13:07,910 --> 00:13:05,110
venevar bush

328
00:13:09,190 --> 00:13:07,920
for all his work and getting

329
00:13:10,949 --> 00:13:09,200
uh

330
00:13:11,750 --> 00:13:10,959
menzel cleared

331
00:13:13,910 --> 00:13:11,760
uh

332
00:13:15,269 --> 00:13:13,920
and allowed to keep his security

333
00:13:17,030 --> 00:13:15,279
clearance and i'm wondering what the

334
00:13:17,990 --> 00:13:17,040
heck why would mental have a security

335
00:13:22,550 --> 00:13:18,000
clearance

336
00:13:25,190 --> 00:13:22,560
teach astronomy at harvard or any place

337
00:13:27,110 --> 00:13:25,200
else as far as i know

338
00:13:28,470 --> 00:13:27,120
so i followed up with the attorney who

339
00:13:29,990 --> 00:13:28,480
had written the letter thanking

340
00:13:31,509 --> 00:13:30,000
vandervar bush

341
00:13:33,750 --> 00:13:31,519
and found out oh there's a thousand

342
00:13:35,990 --> 00:13:33,760
pages in the men's papers at harvard

343
00:13:37,190 --> 00:13:36,000
menzel was dead already

344
00:13:39,350 --> 00:13:37,200
so i had to get permission from three

345
00:13:41,670 --> 00:13:39,360
different people i'll cut to the chase

346
00:13:43,750 --> 00:13:41,680
to see menzel's papers and i did that

347
00:13:45,670 --> 00:13:43,760
written permission mind you

348
00:13:47,509 --> 00:13:45,680
got a little grant from the fund for ufo

349
00:13:48,949 --> 00:13:47,519
research went there the first thing i

350
00:13:50,310 --> 00:13:48,959
looked at there was i didn't know where

351
00:13:52,790 --> 00:13:50,320
to look because i knew that most of his

352
00:13:54,310 --> 00:13:52,800
ufo stuff was not at harvard

353
00:13:56,870 --> 00:13:54,320
it was at the american philosophical

354
00:13:58,470 --> 00:13:56,880
society library in philadelphia

355
00:14:03,030 --> 00:13:58,480
and uh

356
00:14:05,110 --> 00:14:03,040
first thing i looked at was a folder jfk

357
00:14:05,990 --> 00:14:05,120
wonder what that's all about

358
00:14:08,550 --> 00:14:06,000
well

359
00:14:09,990 --> 00:14:08,560
menzel and john f kennedy

360
00:14:11,350 --> 00:14:10,000
the president

361
00:14:13,590 --> 00:14:11,360
to be

362
00:14:15,590 --> 00:14:13,600
he knew him before that

363
00:14:17,750 --> 00:14:15,600
were good old buddies

364
00:14:21,030 --> 00:14:17,760
knew each other very well wrote

365
00:14:23,509 --> 00:14:21,040
called each other by first names uh

366
00:14:25,990 --> 00:14:23,519
and even had breakfast together in

367
00:14:28,790 --> 00:14:26,000
the you know cambridge area

368
00:14:30,550 --> 00:14:28,800
and and his one of his first letters

369
00:14:32,470 --> 00:14:30,560
that i ran across

370
00:14:34,550 --> 00:14:32,480
he mentions that there's kennedy had

371
00:14:36,389 --> 00:14:34,560
already just been elected that there's

372
00:14:38,389 --> 00:14:36,399
one area where i may be able to be of

373
00:14:39,189 --> 00:14:38,399
assistance to you it's with regard to

374
00:14:41,829 --> 00:14:39,199
the

375
00:14:44,069 --> 00:14:41,839
national security agency

376
00:14:46,710 --> 00:14:44,079
i've had a longer continuous association

377
00:14:49,189 --> 00:14:46,720
with them 30 years of anybody

378
00:14:52,389 --> 00:14:49,199
when we are properly cleared to each

379
00:14:53,509 --> 00:14:52,399
other i can tell you more

380
00:14:55,590 --> 00:14:53,519
wow

381
00:14:57,110 --> 00:14:55,600
what the heck was this

382
00:14:59,430 --> 00:14:57,120
so i did a lot of digging in to make a

383
00:15:01,910 --> 00:14:59,440
long story short it turns out menzel it

384
00:15:04,389 --> 00:15:01,920
did work for the nsa

385
00:15:06,949 --> 00:15:04,399
uh for over 30 years

386
00:15:09,829 --> 00:15:06,959
he did all kinds of classified work

387
00:15:11,509 --> 00:15:09,839
he did some work for the cia

388
00:15:13,430 --> 00:15:11,519
this none of this was known on the

389
00:15:15,350 --> 00:15:13,440
outside

390
00:15:18,069 --> 00:15:15,360
uh when i found out he was dead already

391
00:15:18,949 --> 00:15:18,079
so uh but i had the paperwork to prove

392
00:15:21,030 --> 00:15:18,959
it

393
00:15:23,670 --> 00:15:21,040
and i there were people in ufology who

394
00:15:25,430 --> 00:15:23,680
told me uh ah come on stan he couldn't

395
00:15:27,670 --> 00:15:25,440
let a double life

396
00:15:29,670 --> 00:15:27,680
i pointed out that their burgess philby

397
00:15:31,509 --> 00:15:29,680
and mclean were three

398
00:15:33,430 --> 00:15:31,519
russian spies who worked for british

399
00:15:36,629 --> 00:15:33,440
intelligence

400
00:15:37,990 --> 00:15:36,639
uh for years and years many people eat

401
00:15:40,949 --> 00:15:38,000
double lives

402
00:15:41,829 --> 00:15:40,959
but finding out about menzel

403
00:15:44,389 --> 00:15:41,839
uh

404
00:15:46,870 --> 00:15:44,399
was a real shocker i didn't like him

405
00:15:49,829 --> 00:15:46,880
when he was alive but then i respected

406
00:15:51,590 --> 00:15:49,839
him for doing his country's uh work

407
00:15:53,269 --> 00:15:51,600
his classified work

408
00:15:55,749 --> 00:15:53,279
right so it means you gotta look

409
00:15:57,509 --> 00:15:55,759
carefully and long and hard and not jump

410
00:16:00,310 --> 00:15:57,519
to conclusions

411
00:16:02,550 --> 00:16:00,320
and not make up fictional plots if you

412
00:16:04,230 --> 00:16:02,560
will to explain this side of the other

413
00:16:05,990 --> 00:16:04,240
thing

414
00:16:07,590 --> 00:16:06,000
and

415
00:16:10,230 --> 00:16:07,600
let me ask you a question

416
00:16:13,269 --> 00:16:10,240
why do you think

417
00:16:14,790 --> 00:16:13,279
menzel and and phil class i

418
00:16:16,710 --> 00:16:14,800
i had a

419
00:16:20,069 --> 00:16:16,720
heated discussion with phil class in

420
00:16:25,350 --> 00:16:22,550
at a symposium he showed up and he had

421
00:16:27,749 --> 00:16:25,360
uh buttons all over his suit jacket says

422
00:16:29,990 --> 00:16:27,759
talk to me i'm i'm an abductee uh you

423
00:16:31,990 --> 00:16:30,000
know i had another button that says uh

424
00:16:35,269 --> 00:16:32,000
you know i communicate with uh with the

425
00:16:37,910 --> 00:16:35,279
aliens on venus and stuff like that okay

426
00:16:39,350 --> 00:16:37,920
and he well he made a comment that uh

427
00:16:41,829 --> 00:16:39,360
betty cash

428
00:16:43,030 --> 00:16:41,839
and vicki landrum uh the only reason why

429
00:16:45,350 --> 00:16:43,040
they uh

430
00:16:46,310 --> 00:16:45,360
came forward with their story was to to

431
00:16:48,949 --> 00:16:46,320
gain

432
00:16:52,629 --> 00:16:48,959
uh notoriety and publicity and i had

433
00:16:54,870 --> 00:16:52,639
interviewed i reinv rei investigated the

434
00:16:55,670 --> 00:16:54,880
cash land incident

435
00:16:58,069 --> 00:16:55,680
by

436
00:17:00,790 --> 00:16:58,079
john schussler yeah and

437
00:17:02,710 --> 00:17:00,800
yeah and he asked me to do a follow-up

438
00:17:03,749 --> 00:17:02,720
investigation i interviewed those two

439
00:17:07,350 --> 00:17:03,759
ladies

440
00:17:10,549 --> 00:17:07,360
for almost eight hours i sat in betty

441
00:17:12,949 --> 00:17:10,559
cash's house on her couch i found i

442
00:17:13,990 --> 00:17:12,959
found her to be incredibly intelligent

443
00:17:16,630 --> 00:17:14,000
and

444
00:17:19,510 --> 00:17:16,640
very honest i i truly believe that they

445
00:17:21,750 --> 00:17:19,520
encountered something uh out there in in

446
00:17:23,429 --> 00:17:21,760
texas i i don't know what it was but i

447
00:17:26,230 --> 00:17:23,439
truly believe that they and they

448
00:17:28,549 --> 00:17:26,240
certainly didn't do it uh it

449
00:17:29,350 --> 00:17:28,559
it affected their health okay whatever

450
00:17:32,390 --> 00:17:29,360
they

451
00:17:35,830 --> 00:17:32,400
encountered uh physically uh affected

452
00:17:37,350 --> 00:17:35,840
them and i lit into phil class i i said

453
00:17:39,510 --> 00:17:37,360
you haven't talked to these ladies and i

454
00:17:41,510 --> 00:17:39,520
said for you to make a comment like that

455
00:17:42,630 --> 00:17:41,520
i said i think it's irresponsible on

456
00:17:44,470 --> 00:17:42,640
your part

457
00:17:46,470 --> 00:17:44,480
and we were sitting in the bar area of

458
00:17:47,909 --> 00:17:46,480
where the symposium was and a group of

459
00:17:49,350 --> 00:17:47,919
people got around us and i think they

460
00:17:51,190 --> 00:17:49,360
thought

461
00:17:53,430 --> 00:17:51,200
they could feel like fighting

462
00:17:54,870 --> 00:17:53,440
because you know i was very passionate

463
00:17:57,430 --> 00:17:54,880
about the fact that these two ladies

464
00:18:00,470 --> 00:17:57,440
were honest and they didn't make this up

465
00:18:02,150 --> 00:18:00,480
okay and i even i said mr class i said

466
00:18:04,070 --> 00:18:02,160
you don't even know but i said it

467
00:18:06,230 --> 00:18:04,080
affected the very health of these ladies

468
00:18:08,630 --> 00:18:06,240
and ultimately it killed them they died

469
00:18:10,950 --> 00:18:08,640
as a result of uh of the radiation

470
00:18:13,029 --> 00:18:10,960
poisoning that they were exposed to

471
00:18:17,350 --> 00:18:13,039
and there was what the grandson uh colby

472
00:18:19,590 --> 00:18:17,360
colby correct yeah yeah uh no it scarred

473
00:18:22,470 --> 00:18:19,600
him not only physically stanton but it

474
00:18:24,230 --> 00:18:22,480
uh emotionally

475
00:18:26,310 --> 00:18:24,240
you know i think he was eight nine years

476
00:18:29,029 --> 00:18:26,320
old and whatever occurred out there uh

477
00:18:30,789 --> 00:18:29,039
scared the hell out of him and affected

478
00:18:33,029 --> 00:18:30,799
him emotionally

479
00:18:36,549 --> 00:18:33,039
and as you know john schussler is an

480
00:18:39,750 --> 00:18:36,559
outstanding uh engineer uh very

481
00:18:42,150 --> 00:18:39,760
responsible individual yes

482
00:18:45,510 --> 00:18:42,160
and somebody i would trust uh with my

483
00:18:47,909 --> 00:18:45,520
life i think oh he had a very long time

484
00:18:49,990 --> 00:18:47,919
i told john i said he did he did such a

485
00:18:52,789 --> 00:18:50,000
good job investigating the cash land it

486
00:18:55,029 --> 00:18:52,799
was a hell of a research investigation

487
00:18:57,430 --> 00:18:55,039
i mean he crossed his t's and dotted his

488
00:18:59,830 --> 00:18:57,440
eyes and i was thoroughly impressed

489
00:19:03,190 --> 00:18:59,840
and i found that whatever

490
00:19:06,230 --> 00:19:03,200
uh what whatever those two ladies uh uh

491
00:19:07,430 --> 00:19:06,240
happen upon out there in uh in texas uh

492
00:19:09,190 --> 00:19:07,440
i'm 100

493
00:19:10,630 --> 00:19:09,200
believe that uh

494
00:19:11,669 --> 00:19:10,640
that had happened to him that it was a

495
00:19:13,669 --> 00:19:11,679
real

496
00:19:15,830 --> 00:19:13,679
life well you know what was interesting

497
00:19:19,190 --> 00:19:15,840
i interviewed the doctor i think his

498
00:19:21,750 --> 00:19:19,200
name was anderson he was uh one of three

499
00:19:25,110 --> 00:19:21,760
or four in the world that's recognized

500
00:19:28,070 --> 00:19:25,120
on uh radiation poisoning in fact our

501
00:19:30,070 --> 00:19:28,080
government sent him to chernobyl

502
00:19:33,430 --> 00:19:30,080
when they had the meltdown over there

503
00:19:36,470 --> 00:19:33,440
yeah to to assist the russians

504
00:19:38,789 --> 00:19:36,480
and i interviewed him in his office

505
00:19:40,549 --> 00:19:38,799
and he was befuddled

506
00:19:43,029 --> 00:19:40,559
he i remember him sitting back in his

507
00:19:44,710 --> 00:19:43,039
chair and folding his arms and he said

508
00:19:46,150 --> 00:19:44,720
called me a detective i was honored by

509
00:19:49,350 --> 00:19:46,160
that

510
00:19:50,470 --> 00:19:49,360
but he said he said detective he said it

511
00:19:53,510 --> 00:19:50,480
really

512
00:19:57,270 --> 00:19:53,520
uh mystifies me how these two ladies

513
00:19:59,830 --> 00:19:57,280
um got irradiated out there in texas and

514
00:20:02,710 --> 00:19:59,840
and i said are we sure that it was he

515
00:20:04,549 --> 00:20:02,720
said it was classic radiation poisoning

516
00:20:06,390 --> 00:20:04,559
and i said well how

517
00:20:07,830 --> 00:20:06,400
how bad was it he said it would have

518
00:20:10,870 --> 00:20:07,840
been equivalent

519
00:20:13,270 --> 00:20:10,880
uh to being within several miles

520
00:20:14,870 --> 00:20:13,280
uh outside when the bomb of hiroshima

521
00:20:17,830 --> 00:20:14,880
went off he said you would have been

522
00:20:19,909 --> 00:20:17,840
irradiated and uh he said these ladies

523
00:20:22,470 --> 00:20:19,919
had the classic symptoms the the

524
00:20:25,510 --> 00:20:22,480
blistering the fever the hair falling

525
00:20:28,230 --> 00:20:25,520
out the the nausea the sickness

526
00:20:29,350 --> 00:20:28,240
and he just happened to be in the

527
00:20:31,270 --> 00:20:29,360
in the

528
00:20:32,630 --> 00:20:31,280
emergency room when they brought in

529
00:20:34,390 --> 00:20:32,640
vicki landrum

530
00:20:36,390 --> 00:20:34,400
excuse me betty cash it was betty cash

531
00:20:37,909 --> 00:20:36,400
they brought in uh into the emergency

532
00:20:39,750 --> 00:20:37,919
room in the houston hospital he just

533
00:20:41,190 --> 00:20:39,760
happened to be there and uh the

534
00:20:42,149 --> 00:20:41,200
emergency doctors were trying to figure

535
00:20:44,070 --> 00:20:42,159
out what's wrong with them and he

536
00:20:46,149 --> 00:20:44,080
recognized it right away that it was

537
00:20:48,549 --> 00:20:46,159
radiation sickness yeah

538
00:20:50,390 --> 00:20:48,559
and so i hadn't heard that part of the

539
00:20:52,950 --> 00:20:50,400
story before i'm glad to talk to

540
00:20:54,950 --> 00:20:52,960
somebody who had that firsthand contact

541
00:20:59,029 --> 00:20:54,960
with them oh yeah

542
00:21:02,470 --> 00:20:59,039
and and uh we did a um

543
00:21:05,110 --> 00:21:02,480
a show on it uh it was uh on the

544
00:21:07,590 --> 00:21:05,120
unexplained they they did a documentary

545
00:21:10,549 --> 00:21:07,600
on the betty cash vicki landrum incident

546
00:21:12,470 --> 00:21:10,559
and it was just uh amazing uh that's

547
00:21:14,549 --> 00:21:12,480
that to me it was anyway and then have

548
00:21:16,390 --> 00:21:14,559
somebody come along like phil class and

549
00:21:18,950 --> 00:21:16,400
make statement like that it it really

550
00:21:20,470 --> 00:21:18,960
infuriated me because uh he never talked

551
00:21:22,470 --> 00:21:20,480
to the police he didn't even he didn't

552
00:21:24,630 --> 00:21:22,480
even know anything about the case other

553
00:21:26,470 --> 00:21:24,640
than the fact that it made national news

554
00:21:28,789 --> 00:21:26,480
and there had been a documentary done

555
00:21:30,630 --> 00:21:28,799
that's all he knew about it really

556
00:21:32,710 --> 00:21:30,640
remember that the basic rules for

557
00:21:34,950 --> 00:21:32,720
debunkers like class

558
00:21:36,950 --> 00:21:34,960
were one don't bother me with the facts

559
00:21:39,110 --> 00:21:36,960
my mind's made up

560
00:21:41,669 --> 00:21:39,120
two if you can't attack the data attack

561
00:21:43,990 --> 00:21:41,679
the people it's oh absolutely

562
00:21:45,909 --> 00:21:44,000
three do your research by proclamation

563
00:21:48,390 --> 00:21:45,919
investigation is too much trouble and

564
00:21:51,430 --> 00:21:48,400
nobody will know the difference anyway

565
00:21:52,710 --> 00:21:51,440
so he followed those rules pretty well

566
00:21:54,230 --> 00:21:52,720
uh

567
00:21:55,510 --> 00:21:54,240
and he

568
00:21:57,669 --> 00:21:55,520
you know it it

569
00:21:59,750 --> 00:21:57,679
irks the irk the heck out of him when i

570
00:22:01,590 --> 00:21:59,760
was able uh you know when he had to pay

571
00:22:04,149 --> 00:22:01,600
me that money and then when i published

572
00:22:08,230 --> 00:22:04,159
he tried to sue me because i included a

573
00:22:13,830 --> 00:22:11,350
i told him phil you sent me a check

574
00:22:15,990 --> 00:22:13,840
i xeroxed it i took the check to the

575
00:22:18,549 --> 00:22:16,000
bank they cashed it i can do whatever i

576
00:22:20,310 --> 00:22:18,559
damn please with that xerox thank you i

577
00:22:22,870 --> 00:22:20,320
did take out a couple of his bank

578
00:22:24,710 --> 00:22:22,880
account numbers so that you know right

579
00:22:26,630 --> 00:22:24,720
gotta be a decent guy even though he

580
00:22:29,909 --> 00:22:26,640
doesn't deserve it but uh

581
00:22:30,870 --> 00:22:29,919
no it it it's it's amazing it's kind of

582
00:22:33,430 --> 00:22:30,880
like

583
00:22:36,390 --> 00:22:33,440
look i've i've taken on the

584
00:22:38,870 --> 00:22:36,400
names of he and i debated uh on a radio

585
00:22:41,190 --> 00:22:38,880
station in new york and i got by far the

586
00:22:44,230 --> 00:22:41,200
big part of the vote from the audience

587
00:22:45,830 --> 00:22:44,240
and then dr sesstock and i uh who's a

588
00:22:48,390 --> 00:22:45,840
much easier person to get along with

589
00:22:51,430 --> 00:22:48,400
he's from the seti community

590
00:22:52,830 --> 00:22:51,440
we debated on coast to coast radio

591
00:22:56,310 --> 00:22:52,840
and i got

592
00:22:58,470 --> 00:22:56,320
uh 57 percent of the vote he got 33

593
00:23:00,070 --> 00:22:58,480
percent of the vote and 10 said i don't

594
00:23:01,430 --> 00:23:00,080
know who won

595
00:23:02,470 --> 00:23:01,440
uh

596
00:23:03,990 --> 00:23:02,480
but

597
00:23:06,070 --> 00:23:04,000
there are certain rules i was in high

598
00:23:08,950 --> 00:23:06,080
school debating and one rule is you

599
00:23:09,750 --> 00:23:08,960
can't make up things

600
00:23:12,710 --> 00:23:09,760
you know

601
00:23:14,710 --> 00:23:12,720
you gotta deal with the fact right uh

602
00:23:16,710 --> 00:23:14,720
and also

603
00:23:19,110 --> 00:23:16,720
uh you know we live in a society that

604
00:23:22,470 --> 00:23:19,120
depends on evaluation of testimony

605
00:23:24,950 --> 00:23:22,480
whether it's in a court of law

606
00:23:27,510 --> 00:23:24,960
or there are other situations where you

607
00:23:28,870 --> 00:23:27,520
have to get the facts straight

608
00:23:31,909 --> 00:23:28,880
and you know whether you're selling

609
00:23:35,029 --> 00:23:31,919
property and doing all kinds of things

610
00:23:36,710 --> 00:23:35,039
so we have well-established procedures

611
00:23:39,909 --> 00:23:36,720
and sometimes we have to say we don't

612
00:23:42,390 --> 00:23:39,919
know okay that's the way it goes

613
00:23:45,590 --> 00:23:42,400
and you got to ask the right questions

614
00:23:48,950 --> 00:23:45,600
the question isn't are all ufos alien

615
00:23:50,710 --> 00:23:48,960
spacecraft the question is are any

616
00:23:53,430 --> 00:23:50,720
only takes one

617
00:23:55,190 --> 00:23:53,440
well that's right and as a physicist i'm

618
00:23:57,590 --> 00:23:55,200
accustomed to dealing with things where

619
00:23:59,190 --> 00:23:57,600
there's a big disparity but well

620
00:24:01,830 --> 00:23:59,200
uranium-235

621
00:24:04,230 --> 00:24:01,840
seven tenths of one percent

622
00:24:06,549 --> 00:24:04,240
hardly anything worth talking about but

623
00:24:07,990 --> 00:24:06,559
if you want to build an atomic bomb uh

624
00:24:09,990 --> 00:24:08,000
you've got a separate you've got to

625
00:24:13,110 --> 00:24:10,000
enrich uranium

626
00:24:14,149 --> 00:24:13,120
to maybe 80 90 percent

627
00:24:18,549 --> 00:24:14,159
uh

628
00:24:19,669 --> 00:24:18,559
little and you work at it the united

629
00:24:21,830 --> 00:24:19,679
states a lot of people don't realize the

630
00:24:24,230 --> 00:24:21,840
united states during world war ii

631
00:24:26,310 --> 00:24:24,240
built a gaseous diffusion plant that was

632
00:24:28,789 --> 00:24:26,320
a mile long

633
00:24:31,750 --> 00:24:28,799
and you pump uranium hexafluoride gas

634
00:24:34,710 --> 00:24:31,760
through tiny holes and nickel plates

635
00:24:36,950 --> 00:24:34,720
mile long and because u-235 is a little

636
00:24:38,789 --> 00:24:36,960
lighter than u-238

637
00:24:40,470 --> 00:24:38,799
it goes through a little quicker and

638
00:24:42,630 --> 00:24:40,480
suddenly you take it out at one end and

639
00:24:45,590 --> 00:24:42,640
put it back in and keep doing we were

640
00:24:47,430 --> 00:24:45,600
using five percent of all the

641
00:24:49,269 --> 00:24:47,440
electricity produced in the united

642
00:24:51,590 --> 00:24:49,279
states at that time

643
00:24:53,669 --> 00:24:51,600
to separate that isotope

644
00:24:55,590 --> 00:24:53,679
in secret

645
00:24:57,190 --> 00:24:55,600
so the fact that it was only seven

646
00:24:59,269 --> 00:24:57,200
tenths of a percent to begin with is

647
00:25:01,190 --> 00:24:59,279
beside the point we needed it we figured

648
00:25:04,149 --> 00:25:01,200
out a way to get it spent a hell of a

649
00:25:08,470 --> 00:25:06,710
yeah and i i was in radiation shielding

650
00:25:10,149 --> 00:25:08,480
was my big thing working on nuclear

651
00:25:12,310 --> 00:25:10,159
airplanes and nuclear power plants for

652
00:25:14,230 --> 00:25:12,320
space and all that sort of stuff

653
00:25:15,830 --> 00:25:14,240
and you very quickly learn that there

654
00:25:18,390 --> 00:25:15,840
are enormous differences between

655
00:25:20,710 --> 00:25:18,400
isotopes of the same element

656
00:25:22,470 --> 00:25:20,720
and so it matters

657
00:25:24,230 --> 00:25:22,480
use a little more of this instead of

658
00:25:26,310 --> 00:25:24,240
that one you know

659
00:25:28,390 --> 00:25:26,320
you have to deal with the real world the

660
00:25:30,950 --> 00:25:28,400
way it is

661
00:25:32,870 --> 00:25:30,960
and so like i say most sightings can be

662
00:25:34,230 --> 00:25:32,880
explained that's about as useful as

663
00:25:36,660 --> 00:25:34,240
telling the basketball coach you know

664
00:25:39,350 --> 00:25:36,670
most people aren't seven feet tall buddy

665
00:25:41,830 --> 00:25:39,360
[Laughter]

666
00:25:45,029 --> 00:25:41,840
give me one you know right

667
00:25:46,950 --> 00:25:45,039
yeah right yeah that and and i think

668
00:25:48,310 --> 00:25:46,960
um you know you look at the number of

669
00:25:50,310 --> 00:25:48,320
cases

670
00:25:53,590 --> 00:25:50,320
uh that come through

671
00:25:55,269 --> 00:25:53,600
uh just in the last oh since well let's

672
00:25:56,430 --> 00:25:55,279
you know let's say since

673
00:25:59,190 --> 00:25:56,440
uh

674
00:26:02,789 --> 00:25:59,200
1945 when kenneth arnold had his

675
00:26:05,990 --> 00:26:02,799
sighting to to present day 47 47 june

676
00:26:08,470 --> 00:26:06,000
24th 1944 ken you got that wrong that

677
00:26:10,789 --> 00:26:08,480
last time with uh kevin it's 47 today

678
00:26:12,390 --> 00:26:10,799
yeah yeah kevin kevin proved kevin kevin

679
00:26:15,029 --> 00:26:12,400
got on you about that one

680
00:26:16,390 --> 00:26:15,039
yeah he did yeah yeah and stan got on me

681
00:26:17,590 --> 00:26:16,400
there you go that's two of them that's

682
00:26:19,029 --> 00:26:17,600
two yeah

683
00:26:23,190 --> 00:26:19,039
well actually i did it on purpose i just

684
00:26:28,230 --> 00:26:24,390
hey

685
00:26:31,110 --> 00:26:28,240
next week i turned 83 buddy wow oh my

686
00:26:35,430 --> 00:26:31,120
gosh well happy birthday i am old i've

687
00:26:39,750 --> 00:26:37,430
i don't feel so bad then i thought i was

688
00:26:41,430 --> 00:26:39,760
old but uh

689
00:26:43,269 --> 00:26:41,440
yeah you know you know if you take a

690
00:26:45,590 --> 00:26:43,279
look at all those cases

691
00:26:47,830 --> 00:26:45,600
uh up to the present day

692
00:26:49,269 --> 00:26:47,840
and all of the uh and there's some

693
00:26:50,470 --> 00:26:49,279
sensational ones and hell there's

694
00:26:54,230 --> 00:26:50,480
probably a bunch of them we don't even

695
00:26:55,190 --> 00:26:54,240
know about but all of that voluminous

696
00:26:58,149 --> 00:26:55,200
data

697
00:27:00,950 --> 00:26:58,159
um we only need one

698
00:27:03,669 --> 00:27:00,960
and i mean uh you you refer to it as the

699
00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:03,679
cosmic watergate i like that yes

700
00:27:07,590 --> 00:27:06,530
okay because i i think you're right um

701
00:27:09,350 --> 00:27:07,600
[Music]

702
00:27:11,510 --> 00:27:09,360
i think you know there's a number of

703
00:27:14,149 --> 00:27:11,520
cases that i think you can point to

704
00:27:16,070 --> 00:27:14,159
that demonstrate that uh e.t has been

705
00:27:18,630 --> 00:27:16,080
here is coming here and i'm one of those

706
00:27:20,470 --> 00:27:18,640
people that believe that at least one

707
00:27:23,269 --> 00:27:20,480
race continues

708
00:27:25,510 --> 00:27:23,279
to be here and you know with all of that

709
00:27:26,390 --> 00:27:25,520
information and all that data

710
00:27:27,990 --> 00:27:26,400
why

711
00:27:30,470 --> 00:27:28,000
here's my question where i'm leading up

712
00:27:32,830 --> 00:27:30,480
to why would people like phil class

713
00:27:35,830 --> 00:27:32,840
and menzo they have to know

714
00:27:37,909 --> 00:27:35,840
that stanton they they have access to

715
00:27:39,110 --> 00:27:37,919
the same information that we do so why

716
00:27:41,430 --> 00:27:39,120
would they do that or do you think

717
00:27:43,590 --> 00:27:41,440
they're government uh

718
00:27:45,190 --> 00:27:43,600
well like i say with menzel

719
00:27:49,350 --> 00:27:45,200
uh

720
00:27:51,430 --> 00:27:49,360
he worked with the nsa for 30 years

721
00:27:53,430 --> 00:27:51,440
and i have it in writing he wrote jack

722
00:27:56,630 --> 00:27:53,440
kennedy about that

723
00:28:00,149 --> 00:27:56,640
uh and so i can understand menzel and as

724
00:28:03,190 --> 00:28:00,159
a matter of fact we had we tangled once

725
00:28:05,190 --> 00:28:03,200
uh in person well on the phone anyway i

726
00:28:07,430 --> 00:28:05,200
was speaking at harvard

727
00:28:09,269 --> 00:28:07,440
a number of years ago and i called him

728
00:28:11,750 --> 00:28:09,279
when i was on campus a little early and

729
00:28:14,630 --> 00:28:11,760
i had no idea whether the sponsor

730
00:28:17,590 --> 00:28:14,640
an engineering alumni group

731
00:28:19,510 --> 00:28:17,600
not the student activities office uh

732
00:28:22,070 --> 00:28:19,520
i had no idea whether they had done any

733
00:28:23,269 --> 00:28:22,080
publicity besides to their own members

734
00:28:25,750 --> 00:28:23,279
or not

735
00:28:27,750 --> 00:28:25,760
so i called menzel

736
00:28:31,269 --> 00:28:27,760
and and gave my name oh i know all about

737
00:28:33,350 --> 00:28:31,279
you he said that surprised me uh

738
00:28:36,230 --> 00:28:33,360
i've seen letter i said oh you saw my

739
00:28:38,389 --> 00:28:36,240
congressional testimony next to your

740
00:28:42,310 --> 00:28:38,399
uh i've seen letters and memos i didn't

741
00:28:44,789 --> 00:28:42,320
find out what that meant for 40 years

742
00:28:47,669 --> 00:28:44,799
it turns out ed condon had given him

743
00:28:50,549 --> 00:28:47,679
copies of letters that i had sent condon

744
00:28:52,630 --> 00:28:50,559
but uh he said to me you can't be a

745
00:28:55,750 --> 00:28:52,640
scientist and believe in flying saucers

746
00:28:57,430 --> 00:28:55,760
at which i left i couldn't help it

747
00:28:59,510 --> 00:28:57,440
and he started a rant and rave i said

748
00:29:01,909 --> 00:28:59,520
documents i didn't call to argue with

749
00:29:03,990 --> 00:29:01,919
you i called out of courtesy i was

750
00:29:05,830 --> 00:29:04,000
speaking on your campus

751
00:29:07,350 --> 00:29:05,840
i wanted to make sure you knew i was

752
00:29:09,750 --> 00:29:07,360
going to be speaking at eight o'clock at

753
00:29:12,789 --> 00:29:09,760
the whatever the name of all was

754
00:29:14,870 --> 00:29:12,799
oh well of course i won't be there uh i

755
00:29:17,269 --> 00:29:14,880
didn't know at that time that he had

756
00:29:19,590 --> 00:29:17,279
done all his classified work for the nsa

757
00:29:21,029 --> 00:29:19,600
and the cia and all kinds of other

758
00:29:23,430 --> 00:29:21,039
people

759
00:29:24,870 --> 00:29:23,440
uh he was in naval intelligence during

760
00:29:28,710 --> 00:29:24,880
the war

761
00:29:31,350 --> 00:29:28,720
so i changed my attitude about him

762
00:29:33,669 --> 00:29:31,360
he died along the way uh he was doing a

763
00:29:34,950 --> 00:29:33,679
job for his country okay i can i can

764
00:29:36,950 --> 00:29:34,960
handle that

765
00:29:39,590 --> 00:29:36,960
so i can understand him

766
00:29:41,669 --> 00:29:39,600
i never did find what agency phil class

767
00:29:45,350 --> 00:29:41,679
was working for

768
00:29:46,789 --> 00:29:45,360
uh if he was but i i felt that there had

769
00:29:48,389 --> 00:29:46,799
to be

770
00:29:49,909 --> 00:29:48,399
some something going on in the

771
00:29:52,070 --> 00:29:49,919
background there and i don't know what

772
00:29:56,789 --> 00:29:52,080
it was now there are suggestions there's

773
00:29:59,430 --> 00:29:56,799
one book the fortec conspiracy

774
00:30:01,590 --> 00:29:59,440
which is loosely covered up truth and he

775
00:30:03,029 --> 00:30:01,600
portrays phil as

776
00:30:05,430 --> 00:30:03,039
i mean it was obvious phil he was

777
00:30:07,190 --> 00:30:05,440
talking about the author uh as

778
00:30:10,230 --> 00:30:07,200
homosexual

779
00:30:13,269 --> 00:30:10,240
and i wondered whether there wasn't some

780
00:30:14,549 --> 00:30:13,279
blackmailing going on in the background

781
00:30:17,110 --> 00:30:14,559
you know what i mean

782
00:30:21,590 --> 00:30:17,120
yeah well and i mean that may very well

783
00:30:23,350 --> 00:30:21,600
be a a possibility i i know that i

784
00:30:24,710 --> 00:30:23,360
i got into a heated discussion with

785
00:30:27,430 --> 00:30:24,720
richard hall

786
00:30:28,310 --> 00:30:27,440
and he was associated with nycap

787
00:30:30,310 --> 00:30:28,320
and

788
00:30:33,029 --> 00:30:30,320
uh

789
00:30:35,190 --> 00:30:33,039
you know i made a statement we were

790
00:30:36,630 --> 00:30:35,200
in a hotel room in the lobby and i said

791
00:30:38,870 --> 00:30:36,640
well you know

792
00:30:40,789 --> 00:30:38,880
if i was in charge of a government

793
00:30:43,510 --> 00:30:40,799
agency um

794
00:30:45,990 --> 00:30:43,520
pick one one of the alphabet boys fbi

795
00:30:47,590 --> 00:30:46,000
cia nsa or whatever

796
00:30:48,389 --> 00:30:47,600
and i knew that

797
00:30:53,350 --> 00:30:48,399
the

798
00:30:55,750 --> 00:30:53,360
uh was a serious matter that it needed

799
00:30:57,830 --> 00:30:55,760
to be taken seriously although you know

800
00:31:01,190 --> 00:30:57,840
the government got out of it apparently

801
00:31:03,110 --> 00:31:01,200
or so they say but i would infiltrate

802
00:31:07,430 --> 00:31:03,120
organizations like

803
00:31:10,870 --> 00:31:07,440
mufon or nycap nightcap apro yes yeah

804
00:31:12,710 --> 00:31:10,880
absolutely and he took a defensive

805
00:31:14,310 --> 00:31:12,720
position with me and i mean it got

806
00:31:16,470 --> 00:31:14,320
really heated

807
00:31:18,870 --> 00:31:16,480
i knew i touched a nerve and i'm not so

808
00:31:21,190 --> 00:31:18,880
sure that that you know he he knew about

809
00:31:23,190 --> 00:31:21,200
it or may have been associated with it i

810
00:31:25,510 --> 00:31:23,200
don't have any thing to support that but

811
00:31:27,990 --> 00:31:25,520
i know that i touched a nerve because he

812
00:31:30,149 --> 00:31:28,000
took a real uh his whole facial

813
00:31:31,269 --> 00:31:30,159
expression and his posture changed

814
00:31:33,830 --> 00:31:31,279
dramatically

815
00:31:36,789 --> 00:31:33,840
okay kevin for the grand prize of one

816
00:31:38,870 --> 00:31:36,799
million dollars what color is the white

817
00:31:41,509 --> 00:31:38,880
house um

818
00:31:44,230 --> 00:31:41,519
i know this i know this i know this

819
00:31:45,909 --> 00:31:44,240
um five seconds oh

820
00:31:48,070 --> 00:31:45,919
switching to geico could save you a

821
00:31:49,110 --> 00:31:48,080
bunch of money on car insurance

822
00:31:50,789 --> 00:31:49,120
okay

823
00:31:52,830 --> 00:31:50,799
judges

824
00:31:56,310 --> 00:31:52,840
that's true kevin they'll allow it

825
00:31:58,789 --> 00:31:56,320
congratulations you're a winner

826
00:32:01,430 --> 00:31:58,799
geico because saving 15 or more on car

827
00:32:04,789 --> 00:32:01,440
insurance is always the great answer

828
00:32:06,310 --> 00:32:04,799
and and i sense that that the the nerve

829
00:32:08,789 --> 00:32:06,320
was exposed

830
00:32:11,509 --> 00:32:08,799
and and i believe that to be true if i

831
00:32:13,029 --> 00:32:11,519
hey if i'm if i why

832
00:32:14,789 --> 00:32:13,039
why wouldn't you do that

833
00:32:16,950 --> 00:32:14,799
because you're going to have you would

834
00:32:18,710 --> 00:32:16,960
if it's important

835
00:32:20,230 --> 00:32:18,720
obviously it is or they wouldn't say

836
00:32:22,549 --> 00:32:20,240
some of the ridiculous things they've

837
00:32:23,509 --> 00:32:22,559
said and take the measures that they've

838
00:32:26,830 --> 00:32:23,519
taken

839
00:32:29,509 --> 00:32:26,840
to confuse and try to defuse to

840
00:32:31,190 --> 00:32:29,519
misrepresent that it must be important

841
00:32:32,549 --> 00:32:31,200
if they're doing that

842
00:32:34,549 --> 00:32:32,559
so you know

843
00:32:36,950 --> 00:32:34,559
let me give you an example of that when

844
00:32:39,190 --> 00:32:36,960
people may think i'm just

845
00:32:41,590 --> 00:32:39,200
making big noises but

846
00:32:43,669 --> 00:32:41,600
uh one of the important moments for me

847
00:32:45,909 --> 00:32:43,679
in my search for truth about ufos was

848
00:32:49,269 --> 00:32:45,919
stumbling across a copy of project blue

849
00:32:51,190 --> 00:32:49,279
book special report number 14

850
00:32:53,669 --> 00:32:51,200
at the university of california berkeley

851
00:32:54,830 --> 00:32:53,679
library i'd already read 10 books this

852
00:32:57,509 --> 00:32:54,840
is about

853
00:32:59,110 --> 00:32:57,519
1961. i'd read about 10 books and none

854
00:33:01,350 --> 00:32:59,120
of them had mentioned this and here we

855
00:33:02,230 --> 00:33:01,360
have this huge study

856
00:33:04,230 --> 00:33:02,240
and

857
00:33:07,110 --> 00:33:04,240
the version included a press release

858
00:33:08,870 --> 00:33:07,120
that went out when it was completed in

859
00:33:11,029 --> 00:33:08,880
the mid-50s

860
00:33:12,870 --> 00:33:11,039
and in the press release we have the

861
00:33:15,269 --> 00:33:12,880
following statement from the secretary

862
00:33:16,870 --> 00:33:15,279
of the air force mind you not just any

863
00:33:19,430 --> 00:33:16,880
dink you know

864
00:33:21,110 --> 00:33:19,440
and he said on the basis of this study

865
00:33:23,830 --> 00:33:21,120
which did not give the title of the

866
00:33:25,350 --> 00:33:23,840
report special report 14 if some

867
00:33:26,630 --> 00:33:25,360
reporter had seen that he said what

868
00:33:28,070 --> 00:33:26,640
happened to one through 13 we've never

869
00:33:29,669 --> 00:33:28,080
heard anything about them oh well

870
00:33:32,230 --> 00:33:29,679
they're all classified maybe not

871
00:33:35,669 --> 00:33:32,240
entitled anyway

872
00:33:38,310 --> 00:33:35,679
the quote was on the basis of this study

873
00:33:40,549 --> 00:33:38,320
we believe that no objects such as those

874
00:33:43,029 --> 00:33:40,559
properly described as flying saucers

875
00:33:46,470 --> 00:33:43,039
have overflown the united states

876
00:33:47,830 --> 00:33:46,480
even the unknown three percent

877
00:33:50,630 --> 00:33:47,840
could have been identified as

878
00:33:52,630 --> 00:33:50,640
conventional phenomena or illusions if

879
00:33:54,149 --> 00:33:52,640
more complete observational data had

880
00:33:55,750 --> 00:33:54,159
been available

881
00:33:57,029 --> 00:33:55,760
now that sounds like that really takes

882
00:34:00,310 --> 00:33:57,039
care of the matter doesn't it the

883
00:34:02,149 --> 00:34:00,320
trouble is i had a copy of the report

884
00:34:03,990 --> 00:34:02,159
uh which didn't incidentally give the

885
00:34:06,070 --> 00:34:04,000
title of the author the name of the

886
00:34:08,230 --> 00:34:06,080
author didn't say that the work was done

887
00:34:09,589 --> 00:34:08,240
under the auspices of the patel memorial

888
00:34:11,829 --> 00:34:09,599
institute

889
00:34:14,389 --> 00:34:11,839
in columbus ohio a very well respected

890
00:34:16,710 --> 00:34:14,399
research and development firm

891
00:34:17,829 --> 00:34:16,720
i know i had professional dealings with

892
00:34:18,629 --> 00:34:17,839
them

893
00:34:21,270 --> 00:34:18,639
uh

894
00:34:23,510 --> 00:34:21,280
now you look in the report

895
00:34:25,030 --> 00:34:23,520
and it's chock full of graphs tables

896
00:34:26,629 --> 00:34:25,040
charts maps

897
00:34:28,710 --> 00:34:26,639
loaded with data

898
00:34:31,030 --> 00:34:28,720
you look in the report and you find out

899
00:34:32,950 --> 00:34:31,040
that the unknowns weren't three percent

900
00:34:34,869 --> 00:34:32,960
they were 21.5

901
00:34:37,990 --> 00:34:34,879
which sure isn't three percent rounded

902
00:34:41,829 --> 00:34:40,310
they had a quality evaluation of all the

903
00:34:43,829 --> 00:34:41,839
sightings

904
00:34:47,510 --> 00:34:43,839
you find that the better the quality the

905
00:34:49,909 --> 00:34:47,520
more likely to be unexplainable right

906
00:34:51,430 --> 00:34:49,919
they asked an obvious question they had

907
00:34:53,109 --> 00:34:51,440
all this data

908
00:34:55,430 --> 00:34:53,119
they said is there really any difference

909
00:34:57,589 --> 00:34:55,440
between the unknowns the only ones we're

910
00:34:59,670 --> 00:34:57,599
interested in and the nouns let's do a

911
00:35:01,510 --> 00:34:59,680
statistical cross comparison a

912
00:35:03,349 --> 00:35:01,520
chi-square analysis for any

913
00:35:04,950 --> 00:35:03,359
mathematicians out there

914
00:35:06,870 --> 00:35:04,960
they looked at things like apparent size

915
00:35:08,630 --> 00:35:06,880
color shape speed that sort of thing six

916
00:35:10,630 --> 00:35:08,640
different characteristics

917
00:35:13,190 --> 00:35:10,640
they found that the probability that the

918
00:35:16,790 --> 00:35:13,200
unknowns were just misknowns

919
00:35:18,950 --> 00:35:16,800
was less than one percent

920
00:35:22,950 --> 00:35:18,960
in other words not even close

921
00:35:25,190 --> 00:35:22,960
but they also uh found that uh the

922
00:35:27,510 --> 00:35:25,200
duration of observation was longer for

923
00:35:29,990 --> 00:35:27,520
the unknowns than for the knowns and

924
00:35:32,630 --> 00:35:30,000
they had a separate category called

925
00:35:34,069 --> 00:35:32,640
insufficient information

926
00:35:35,349 --> 00:35:34,079
so the notion that the sightings were

927
00:35:37,829 --> 00:35:35,359
just the ones for which there wasn't

928
00:35:41,030 --> 00:35:37,839
enough data was totally false these are

929
00:35:42,390 --> 00:35:41,040
flat out lies from the secretary of the

930
00:35:43,750 --> 00:35:42,400
air force

931
00:35:46,230 --> 00:35:43,760
now i'm not saying somebody else didn't

932
00:35:48,150 --> 00:35:46,240
write him them for him you know he may

933
00:35:49,829 --> 00:35:48,160
have known nothing but

934
00:35:53,150 --> 00:35:49,839
that's what he said

935
00:35:55,109 --> 00:35:53,160
that is clear and unambiguous

936
00:35:57,190 --> 00:35:55,119
misrepresentation to the public from the

937
00:35:58,390 --> 00:35:57,200
secretary of the air force

938
00:36:01,349 --> 00:35:58,400
it's one of the things that really

939
00:36:03,030 --> 00:36:01,359
turned me on i don't like being lied to

940
00:36:04,950 --> 00:36:03,040
yeah you and me

941
00:36:07,270 --> 00:36:04,960
i had a security clearance sometimes you

942
00:36:08,870 --> 00:36:07,280
have to tiptoe around the truth a little

943
00:36:11,750 --> 00:36:08,880
bit uh

944
00:36:12,550 --> 00:36:11,760
but that's not the same as

945
00:36:13,349 --> 00:36:12,560
uh

946
00:36:18,390 --> 00:36:13,359
well

947
00:36:20,150 --> 00:36:18,400
i mean that that's kind of like in your

948
00:36:21,910 --> 00:36:20,160
face lie

949
00:36:24,230 --> 00:36:21,920
okay i mean it's one thing it's one

950
00:36:27,589 --> 00:36:24,240
thing to stretch the truth or

951
00:36:30,710 --> 00:36:27,599
uh be evasive in in your answer

952
00:36:32,870 --> 00:36:30,720
okay but to just come out and flat out

953
00:36:34,790 --> 00:36:32,880
in your face lie

954
00:36:37,030 --> 00:36:34,800
yeah that's what that's what it is

955
00:36:38,950 --> 00:36:37,040
that's what turned me on i mean

956
00:36:41,990 --> 00:36:38,960
it made me angry

957
00:36:44,790 --> 00:36:42,000
again i i was young and uh you know

958
00:36:47,829 --> 00:36:44,800
bushy-eyed and bushy-tailed right right

959
00:36:50,950 --> 00:36:47,839
right right and i expected better from

960
00:36:53,510 --> 00:36:50,960
my government as a scientist you know

961
00:36:55,190 --> 00:36:53,520
i i don't expect people to lie to me and

962
00:36:57,430 --> 00:36:55,200
the work that i was doing and i looked i

963
00:36:59,990 --> 00:36:57,440
worked in radiation shielding for

964
00:37:02,069 --> 00:37:00,000
nuclear airplanes for fishing rockets or

965
00:37:04,310 --> 00:37:02,079
fusion rockets

966
00:37:07,270 --> 00:37:04,320
nuclear power plants of all kinds

967
00:37:09,750 --> 00:37:07,280
i was interested in facts and data

968
00:37:11,109 --> 00:37:09,760
and as a matter of fact

969
00:37:12,710 --> 00:37:11,119
funny story

970
00:37:14,950 --> 00:37:12,720
uh

971
00:37:17,270 --> 00:37:14,960
about two weeks before we were supposed

972
00:37:19,109 --> 00:37:17,280
to test our nuclear rocket engine

973
00:37:20,630 --> 00:37:19,119
westinghouse astronuclear lab in

974
00:37:22,550 --> 00:37:20,640
pittsburgh

975
00:37:24,630 --> 00:37:22,560
guys come to me from the projects and

976
00:37:26,790 --> 00:37:24,640
say i was working on radiation shielding

977
00:37:28,470 --> 00:37:26,800
for this system stan can you give us a

978
00:37:30,230 --> 00:37:28,480
better handle on the heating and the

979
00:37:33,109 --> 00:37:30,240
control veins

980
00:37:35,109 --> 00:37:33,119
uh we don't really want to melt them but

981
00:37:37,109 --> 00:37:35,119
we don't have any data

982
00:37:38,710 --> 00:37:37,119
because it's hard to calculate that the

983
00:37:40,550 --> 00:37:38,720
geometry stuff and all those sort of

984
00:37:42,790 --> 00:37:40,560
things so okay

985
00:37:44,470 --> 00:37:42,800
i'll see what i can do we had a mock-up

986
00:37:46,150 --> 00:37:44,480
system where i could i talked to the

987
00:37:47,670 --> 00:37:46,160
people down there

988
00:37:49,750 --> 00:37:47,680
15 miles away

989
00:37:52,870 --> 00:37:49,760
uh we i set up a bunch of experiments

990
00:37:55,510 --> 00:37:52,880
and within three days we had data

991
00:37:56,630 --> 00:37:55,520
that seemed to indicate they were not in

992
00:37:58,630 --> 00:37:56,640
trouble

993
00:38:01,270 --> 00:37:58,640
uh it was okay

994
00:38:02,950 --> 00:38:01,280
and then we ran the test and i suddenly

995
00:38:05,670 --> 00:38:02,960
realized

996
00:38:08,790 --> 00:38:05,680
uh gee whiz if this thing melts they're

997
00:38:13,910 --> 00:38:11,910
and i was kind of worried

998
00:38:16,550 --> 00:38:13,920
uh you know because there are

999
00:38:18,550 --> 00:38:16,560
implications here uh we asked you to get

1000
00:38:23,190 --> 00:38:18,560
us data and you did and

1001
00:38:27,670 --> 00:38:26,069
mr friedman let me

1002
00:38:29,190 --> 00:38:27,680
you believe i

1003
00:38:31,750 --> 00:38:29,200
and i do that

1004
00:38:35,190 --> 00:38:31,760
something extraordinary crashed

1005
00:38:36,950 --> 00:38:35,200
in 1947 out there in roswell and well

1006
00:38:38,390 --> 00:38:36,960
actually near corona

1007
00:38:39,750 --> 00:38:38,400
right right

1008
00:38:40,870 --> 00:38:39,760
right yes

1009
00:38:46,630 --> 00:38:40,880
and

1010
00:38:48,710 --> 00:38:46,640
um

1011
00:38:51,109 --> 00:38:48,720
explanations uh from you know like the

1012
00:38:52,950 --> 00:38:51,119
air force well and let me before we go

1013
00:38:54,790 --> 00:38:52,960
any further one of the things that uh

1014
00:38:55,750 --> 00:38:54,800
kevin and i got into a heated discussion

1015
00:38:57,270 --> 00:38:55,760
about

1016
00:38:59,910 --> 00:38:57,280
um you know the

1017
00:39:00,710 --> 00:38:59,920
roswell daily record the next day says

1018
00:39:04,390 --> 00:39:00,720
that

1019
00:39:07,109 --> 00:39:04,400
the raf captures flying saucer on ranch

1020
00:39:09,990 --> 00:39:07,119
in roswell and he he

1021
00:39:12,870 --> 00:39:10,000
qualified that and in his book

1022
00:39:16,870 --> 00:39:12,880
roswell in the 21st century he said well

1023
00:39:19,589 --> 00:39:16,880
you know flying saucer didn't mean alien

1024
00:39:21,670 --> 00:39:19,599
uh craft back in 1947 there were a

1025
00:39:24,470 --> 00:39:21,680
number of articles

1026
00:39:26,829 --> 00:39:24,480
written by journalists

1027
00:39:29,190 --> 00:39:26,839
that didn't necessarily equate flying

1028
00:39:31,829 --> 00:39:29,200
saucer uh to

1029
00:39:33,990 --> 00:39:31,839
uh or excuse me a flying saucer to et

1030
00:39:36,310 --> 00:39:34,000
technology and i said yeah but the

1031
00:39:37,349 --> 00:39:36,320
problem kevin i said though in the front

1032
00:39:40,310 --> 00:39:37,359
page

1033
00:39:42,870 --> 00:39:40,320
uh uh in the body of the of the uh of

1034
00:39:44,950 --> 00:39:42,880
the newspaper it's a it refers to it as

1035
00:39:46,950 --> 00:39:44,960
a flying disc

1036
00:39:48,550 --> 00:39:46,960
and i said if you put flying saucer and

1037
00:39:52,390 --> 00:39:48,560
flying this together i don't care if

1038
00:39:54,550 --> 00:39:52,400
it's 1947 or 2017. people are going to

1039
00:39:56,390 --> 00:39:54,560
equate that with something

1040
00:39:57,750 --> 00:39:56,400
that's not on this planet or comes from

1041
00:39:59,270 --> 00:39:57,760
this planet

1042
00:40:01,430 --> 00:39:59,280
and he goes oh no that's not that's

1043
00:40:04,069 --> 00:40:01,440
incorrect and i don't i disagree i think

1044
00:40:05,829 --> 00:40:04,079
in 1947 if you'd have told somebody that

1045
00:40:07,670 --> 00:40:05,839
you saw a flying saucer that they would

1046
00:40:10,790 --> 00:40:07,680
think that you saw something

1047
00:40:11,990 --> 00:40:10,800
uh excited to disagree with you

1048
00:40:14,069 --> 00:40:12,000
uh

1049
00:40:16,230 --> 00:40:14,079
i couldn't find any coverage in those

1050
00:40:17,589 --> 00:40:16,240
early days and i looked a lot of people

1051
00:40:19,910 --> 00:40:17,599
think that article was only in the

1052
00:40:23,190 --> 00:40:19,920
roswell paper but it was in the chicago

1053
00:40:25,349 --> 00:40:23,200
daily news in the sacramento bee the

1054
00:40:27,430 --> 00:40:25,359
spokane chronicle and a whole bunch of

1055
00:40:30,470 --> 00:40:27,440
other papers it it really was from

1056
00:40:32,550 --> 00:40:30,480
chicago west the original story came out

1057
00:40:34,310 --> 00:40:32,560
too late for the morning papers you know

1058
00:40:35,270 --> 00:40:34,320
for the east and for the east coast

1059
00:40:37,510 --> 00:40:35,280
papers

1060
00:40:39,670 --> 00:40:37,520
right but uh you don't find people

1061
00:40:42,390 --> 00:40:39,680
talking about little green men aliens

1062
00:40:45,670 --> 00:40:42,400
none of that shows up at that time

1063
00:40:47,670 --> 00:40:45,680
uh flying saucer because kenneth arnold

1064
00:40:49,910 --> 00:40:47,680
said they moved as a saucer would if you

1065
00:40:53,349 --> 00:40:49,920
skipped it across the water

1066
00:40:56,150 --> 00:40:53,359
so it was a descriptive of shape

1067
00:40:58,390 --> 00:40:56,160
but not source in other words not from

1068
00:41:01,430 --> 00:40:58,400
aliens or anything like that

1069
00:41:03,829 --> 00:41:01,440
that's a point well made yeah

1070
00:41:06,550 --> 00:41:03,839
well i i've looked at those early papers

1071
00:41:08,230 --> 00:41:06,560
partly because i had a guy who wound up

1072
00:41:09,750 --> 00:41:08,240
being a congressman who told me well it

1073
00:41:11,510 --> 00:41:09,760
couldn't have been a big story because

1074
00:41:13,190 --> 00:41:11,520
it appeared only in that little tiny

1075
00:41:14,470 --> 00:41:13,200
roswell paper

1076
00:41:17,190 --> 00:41:14,480
and i had sent

1077
00:41:19,430 --> 00:41:17,200
the station copies of headline articles

1078
00:41:21,270 --> 00:41:19,440
from other papers much

1079
00:41:23,990 --> 00:41:21,280
every paper is bigger than the roswell

1080
00:41:25,670 --> 00:41:24,950
uh

1081
00:41:26,870 --> 00:41:25,680
so

1082
00:41:32,870 --> 00:41:26,880
uh

1083
00:41:34,550 --> 00:41:32,880
that flying saucer didn't mean alien

1084
00:41:36,630 --> 00:41:34,560
uh but

1085
00:41:37,670 --> 00:41:36,640
that's beside the point

1086
00:41:41,109 --> 00:41:37,680
really

1087
00:41:42,950 --> 00:41:41,119
uh and also r-a-a-f somebody tried to

1088
00:41:45,349 --> 00:41:42,960
tell me that's royal australian air

1089
00:41:48,630 --> 00:41:45,359
force stan and i said no

1090
00:41:49,430 --> 00:41:48,640
army airfield airport yeah airfield yeah

1091
00:41:51,990 --> 00:41:49,440
yeah

1092
00:41:55,270 --> 00:41:52,000
you know people make mistakes

1093
00:41:56,390 --> 00:41:55,280
but remember again that

1094
00:41:58,470 --> 00:41:56,400
kevin

1095
00:42:01,589 --> 00:41:58,480
writing fiction has the luxury of making

1096
00:42:03,829 --> 00:42:01,599
plots come out any way he wants them to

1097
00:42:04,630 --> 00:42:03,839
and i envy him that

1098
00:42:06,390 --> 00:42:04,640
uh

1099
00:42:07,589 --> 00:42:06,400
let me give you an example to see the

1100
00:42:09,109 --> 00:42:07,599
difference here

1101
00:42:11,589 --> 00:42:09,119
he uh

1102
00:42:13,349 --> 00:42:11,599
said that the mj 12 documents are phony

1103
00:42:15,430 --> 00:42:13,359
because

1104
00:42:17,750 --> 00:42:15,440
uh

1105
00:42:21,109 --> 00:42:17,760
it says admiral

1106
00:42:23,109 --> 00:42:21,119
hillen roscoe hillen coder

1107
00:42:27,109 --> 00:42:23,119
and the briefing for uh

1108
00:42:28,550 --> 00:42:27,119
from truman i mean for eisenhower on

1109
00:42:31,270 --> 00:42:28,560
and

1110
00:42:34,870 --> 00:42:31,280
i say that but that's

1111
00:42:38,230 --> 00:42:34,880
not the point at all because

1112
00:42:41,109 --> 00:42:38,240
we use generic ranks for all kinds of

1113
00:42:42,630 --> 00:42:41,119
people it's standard practice

1114
00:42:45,109 --> 00:42:42,640
and when i went to the eisenhower

1115
00:42:48,230 --> 00:42:45,119
library i dug out a bunch of

1116
00:42:49,589 --> 00:42:48,240
memcon's they're called miranda

1117
00:42:50,870 --> 00:42:49,599
communications

1118
00:42:53,030 --> 00:42:50,880
something like that

1119
00:42:56,829 --> 00:42:53,040
that general good pastor

1120
00:42:59,430 --> 00:42:56,839
wrote for eisenhower he was his staff

1121
00:43:01,589 --> 00:42:59,440
secretary and he was a general and he

1122
00:43:02,470 --> 00:43:01,599
listed at the beginning of each of these

1123
00:43:04,230 --> 00:43:02,480
things

1124
00:43:07,190 --> 00:43:04,240
the attendees

1125
00:43:10,710 --> 00:43:07,200
always using only generic ranks you know

1126
00:43:13,109 --> 00:43:10,720
admiral general not rear admiral not the

1127
00:43:15,190 --> 00:43:13,119
lieutenant general but

1128
00:43:19,349 --> 00:43:15,200
standard generic ranks

1129
00:43:21,109 --> 00:43:19,359
but he signed he called himself general

1130
00:43:23,270 --> 00:43:21,119
good pastor

1131
00:43:24,950 --> 00:43:23,280
but he was really only a brigadier

1132
00:43:27,270 --> 00:43:24,960
general

1133
00:43:29,430 --> 00:43:27,280
but it was he signed it

1134
00:43:31,270 --> 00:43:29,440
brigadier general

1135
00:43:33,109 --> 00:43:31,280
but there's kevin saying that the

1136
00:43:36,550 --> 00:43:33,119
biggest reason for saying the document's

1137
00:43:40,069 --> 00:43:36,560
phony and kevin had a 20 years he worked

1138
00:43:42,150 --> 00:43:40,079
for the military yeah he was a criminal

1139
00:43:44,550 --> 00:43:42,160
i mean i get credit for that you know he

1140
00:43:45,430 --> 00:43:44,560
knows about the military and i you know

1141
00:43:49,910 --> 00:43:45,440
i

1142
00:43:50,790 --> 00:43:49,920
long story but uh

1143
00:43:54,550 --> 00:43:50,800
so

1144
00:43:57,270 --> 00:43:54,560
good

1145
00:43:58,710 --> 00:43:57,280
it's true he was not a

1146
00:44:01,910 --> 00:43:58,720
uh full

1147
00:44:03,670 --> 00:44:01,920
admiral he was a rear admiral but that's

1148
00:44:05,990 --> 00:44:03,680
no excuse to say the documents funny

1149
00:44:12,470 --> 00:44:06,000
because all the ranks were generic ranks

1150
00:44:15,750 --> 00:44:14,470
kind of a flat foot cop but it makes

1151
00:44:18,309 --> 00:44:15,760
sense to me

1152
00:44:20,870 --> 00:44:18,319
um i operate under the kiss principle

1153
00:44:22,710 --> 00:44:20,880
keep it simple stupid but it makes sense

1154
00:44:23,910 --> 00:44:22,720
it makes sense to me

1155
00:44:26,309 --> 00:44:23,920
that

1156
00:44:29,109 --> 00:44:26,319
if something as

1157
00:44:30,950 --> 00:44:29,119
important something as critical as

1158
00:44:34,230 --> 00:44:30,960
having a

1159
00:44:35,589 --> 00:44:34,240
saucer type craft fall into your lap

1160
00:44:37,510 --> 00:44:35,599
that the government wouldn't put

1161
00:44:39,910 --> 00:44:37,520
together a special

1162
00:44:41,349 --> 00:44:39,920
panel a special organization in order to

1163
00:44:43,190 --> 00:44:41,359
deal with it

1164
00:44:44,870 --> 00:44:43,200
yeah i i mean there's there's a whole

1165
00:44:46,550 --> 00:44:44,880
bunch of examples

1166
00:44:49,670 --> 00:44:46,560
of where the government has done just

1167
00:44:52,550 --> 00:44:49,680
that in terms of putting together a

1168
00:44:55,430 --> 00:44:52,560
special panel to to deal with something

1169
00:44:57,270 --> 00:44:55,440
uh whether it's you know the uh cuban

1170
00:45:00,230 --> 00:44:57,280
missile crisis or

1171
00:45:02,550 --> 00:45:00,240
or whatever it they i mean

1172
00:45:05,190 --> 00:45:02,560
the president needs

1173
00:45:07,270 --> 00:45:05,200
advisories he needs a panel to advise

1174
00:45:09,349 --> 00:45:07,280
him and something as important as exotic

1175
00:45:10,309 --> 00:45:09,359
as this makes sense that they would put

1176
00:45:12,150 --> 00:45:10,319
together

1177
00:45:14,150 --> 00:45:12,160
uh an mj12

1178
00:45:14,870 --> 00:45:14,160
type of panel and how to deal with it

1179
00:45:16,790 --> 00:45:14,880
yeah

1180
00:45:18,630 --> 00:45:16,800
i'm in full agreement with that and you

1181
00:45:22,550 --> 00:45:18,640
know i've written a whole book top

1182
00:45:24,710 --> 00:45:22,560
secret slash magic about mj 12

1183
00:45:25,670 --> 00:45:24,720
and that that's one of the points that i

1184
00:45:27,589 --> 00:45:25,680
made

1185
00:45:29,589 --> 00:45:27,599
we had a lot of questions that we needed

1186
00:45:31,109 --> 00:45:29,599
answers for what do these guys want

1187
00:45:32,790 --> 00:45:31,119
where are they from what are they what

1188
00:45:33,910 --> 00:45:32,800
are their intentions the cold war was

1189
00:45:35,829 --> 00:45:33,920
heating up

1190
00:45:39,190 --> 00:45:35,839
they're little guys maybe uh they're

1191
00:45:41,109 --> 00:45:39,200
working with the chinese who knows uh

1192
00:45:42,470 --> 00:45:41,119
it could not and

1193
00:45:44,550 --> 00:45:42,480
what are you gonna tell the public we

1194
00:45:46,470 --> 00:45:44,560
just had the world's worst war

1195
00:45:48,230 --> 00:45:46,480
killed 50 million of our own kind we

1196
00:45:51,030 --> 00:45:48,240
nice earthlings did

1197
00:45:53,510 --> 00:45:51,040
destroyed 1700 cities

1198
00:45:54,470 --> 00:45:53,520
dropping bombs all over the place

1199
00:45:56,069 --> 00:45:54,480
uh

1200
00:45:57,510 --> 00:45:56,079
and we're going to tell the people oh we

1201
00:45:59,349 --> 00:45:57,520
thought you'd like to know you don't

1202
00:46:02,069 --> 00:45:59,359
have enough troubles a good part of the

1203
00:46:04,069 --> 00:46:02,079
world was starving still in 47

1204
00:46:05,109 --> 00:46:04,079
but they're these alien visitors and we

1205
00:46:06,710 --> 00:46:05,119
don't know what they want where they're

1206
00:46:08,230 --> 00:46:06,720
from but we thought you'd like to be

1207
00:46:10,950 --> 00:46:08,240
aware of that i mean and we can't do

1208
00:46:12,470 --> 00:46:10,960
anything about them so to get used to it

1209
00:46:14,630 --> 00:46:12,480
yeah i mean

1210
00:46:16,950 --> 00:46:14,640
president truman couldn't possibly do

1211
00:46:19,510 --> 00:46:16,960
that and you know we talk about secrecy

1212
00:46:22,309 --> 00:46:19,520
people forget he didn't know about the

1213
00:46:24,390 --> 00:46:22,319
manhattan project no and yet

1214
00:46:26,550 --> 00:46:24,400
and he had been in the senate

1215
00:46:29,349 --> 00:46:26,560
and was vice president

1216
00:46:32,710 --> 00:46:29,359
and he didn't find out he got briefed 13

1217
00:46:35,190 --> 00:46:32,720
days after roosevelt died because he had

1218
00:46:36,550 --> 00:46:35,200
to make the decision to drop the atomic

1219
00:46:38,069 --> 00:46:36,560
bomb well there were thousands of people

1220
00:46:39,430 --> 00:46:38,079
that worked on the manhattan project

1221
00:46:42,150 --> 00:46:39,440
they didn't have any idea what the hell

1222
00:46:43,829 --> 00:46:42,160
they were working on i mean they had

1223
00:46:45,750 --> 00:46:43,839
they were compartmentalized and they had

1224
00:46:48,069 --> 00:46:45,760
a little piece of the puzzle but very

1225
00:46:49,990 --> 00:46:48,079
few people knew the whole picture

1226
00:46:52,710 --> 00:46:50,000
that's right and it's a good thing they

1227
00:46:56,790 --> 00:46:52,720
didn't uh you know oh yeah

1228
00:46:58,150 --> 00:46:56,800
as it was uh sometimes we make mistakes

1229
00:47:00,470 --> 00:46:58,160
a general

1230
00:47:02,069 --> 00:47:00,480
the guy who was head of the manhattan

1231
00:47:08,150 --> 00:47:02,079
project

1232
00:47:10,150 --> 00:47:08,160
groves leslie groves was asked in 1948

1233
00:47:12,950 --> 00:47:10,160
how long do you think it'll be before

1234
00:47:15,109 --> 00:47:12,960
the russians have the atomic bomb

1235
00:47:16,150 --> 00:47:15,119
because the cold war was heating up

1236
00:47:17,910 --> 00:47:16,160
certainly

1237
00:47:20,069 --> 00:47:17,920
and he hemmed in hard and said well look

1238
00:47:22,309 --> 00:47:20,079
they lost 20 million people during the

1239
00:47:24,550 --> 00:47:22,319
war their industrial capacity was was

1240
00:47:27,349 --> 00:47:24,560
badly hurt they don't have a system for

1241
00:47:29,670 --> 00:47:27,359
dropping it for delivering it

1242
00:47:31,829 --> 00:47:29,680
probably take about eight years

1243
00:47:35,270 --> 00:47:31,839
but would you believe that that was in

1244
00:47:36,829 --> 00:47:35,280
48 that in 1949 the russians tested

1245
00:47:39,990 --> 00:47:36,839
their first vehicle caught us

1246
00:47:42,710 --> 00:47:40,000
flat-footed and about the method for

1247
00:47:43,829 --> 00:47:42,720
delivering we had left the b-29 over

1248
00:47:47,589 --> 00:47:43,839
there

1249
00:47:49,589 --> 00:47:47,599
uh used wartime len lease you know

1250
00:47:51,430 --> 00:47:49,599
and they had

1251
00:47:53,190 --> 00:47:51,440
made chinese copies of it if you want to

1252
00:47:55,349 --> 00:47:53,200
put it that way

1253
00:47:57,270 --> 00:47:55,359
remember how we used to talk about the

1254
00:47:59,349 --> 00:47:57,280
japanese i guess it was

1255
00:48:01,270 --> 00:47:59,359
uh well they're

1256
00:48:03,430 --> 00:48:01,280
they're russian backfire bomber what

1257
00:48:04,829 --> 00:48:03,440
they what they called was a duplicate

1258
00:48:08,309 --> 00:48:04,839
basically of the

1259
00:48:10,069 --> 00:48:08,319
b-29 i mean they they copied it

1260
00:48:12,230 --> 00:48:10,079
you have to understand

1261
00:48:13,910 --> 00:48:12,240
that we were very much concerned we

1262
00:48:15,910 --> 00:48:13,920
didn't even have a radar net around the

1263
00:48:18,230 --> 00:48:15,920
united states what's the need what's the

1264
00:48:20,470 --> 00:48:18,240
rush we got the ground observer core

1265
00:48:22,069 --> 00:48:20,480
they can see the russian planes coming

1266
00:48:23,670 --> 00:48:22,079
except the risks don't have any points

1267
00:48:24,549 --> 00:48:23,680
and nothing to worry about you know

1268
00:48:28,309 --> 00:48:24,559
right

1269
00:48:29,829 --> 00:48:28,319
president truman was in a difficult

1270
00:48:31,190 --> 00:48:29,839
situation

1271
00:48:32,150 --> 00:48:31,200
he certainly

1272
00:48:32,829 --> 00:48:32,160
couldn't

1273
00:48:36,470 --> 00:48:32,839
go

1274
00:48:38,950 --> 00:48:36,480
public with alien spacecraft unknown

1275
00:48:39,829 --> 00:48:38,960
objective unknown source

1276
00:48:41,910 --> 00:48:39,839
uh

1277
00:48:43,829 --> 00:48:41,920
couldn't possibly do that the world was

1278
00:48:45,750 --> 00:48:43,839
in terrible shape at the time was the

1279
00:48:47,190 --> 00:48:45,760
last thing we needed

1280
00:48:49,430 --> 00:48:47,200
and also

1281
00:48:50,790 --> 00:48:49,440
uh maybe we can figure out how these

1282
00:48:52,950 --> 00:48:50,800
things work

1283
00:48:54,710 --> 00:48:52,960
so we can build better airplanes

1284
00:48:56,230 --> 00:48:54,720
and how can we put anything out on the

1285
00:48:58,150 --> 00:48:56,240
table if the other guy doesn't put

1286
00:48:59,829 --> 00:48:58,160
anything out on the table you know so he

1287
00:49:01,589 --> 00:48:59,839
knows what we know and we don't know

1288
00:49:02,390 --> 00:49:01,599
what he knows

1289
00:49:03,270 --> 00:49:02,400
so

1290
00:49:10,870 --> 00:49:03,280
i

1291
00:49:13,670 --> 00:49:10,880
mean that

1292
00:49:15,589 --> 00:49:13,680
but you had a situation which required

1293
00:49:17,990 --> 00:49:15,599
some careful thought

1294
00:49:19,670 --> 00:49:18,000
and real determination where do we want

1295
00:49:21,829 --> 00:49:19,680
to go with this

1296
00:49:24,790 --> 00:49:21,839
you know how much danger is the planet

1297
00:49:27,990 --> 00:49:24,800
in that's not a trivial question no it's

1298
00:49:31,349 --> 00:49:28,000
not and i mean and what what are their

1299
00:49:32,309 --> 00:49:31,359
intentions i mean why why are they here

1300
00:49:34,790 --> 00:49:32,319
okay

1301
00:49:36,630 --> 00:49:34,800
i i mean are are they interested in us

1302
00:49:38,549 --> 00:49:36,640
or the planet itself and if it's the

1303
00:49:40,230 --> 00:49:38,559
planet or themselves

1304
00:49:42,150 --> 00:49:40,240
then you know they may just sweep us

1305
00:49:43,589 --> 00:49:42,160
aside like a broom and said you know we

1306
00:49:44,870 --> 00:49:43,599
don't need these

1307
00:49:46,710 --> 00:49:44,880
earthlings

1308
00:49:48,630 --> 00:49:46,720
well let me that kind of leads me up to

1309
00:49:50,710 --> 00:49:48,640
my next question

1310
00:49:53,430 --> 00:49:50,720
what about today

1311
00:49:56,230 --> 00:49:53,440
why why still put the facade and

1312
00:49:57,670 --> 00:49:56,240
continue to lie i i under i mean i get

1313
00:49:59,829 --> 00:49:57,680
it you know once you tell a lie you got

1314
00:50:02,309 --> 00:49:59,839
to tell another lie to cover up that lie

1315
00:50:05,589 --> 00:50:02,319
or perpetuate it but i mean now we're in

1316
00:50:07,109 --> 00:50:05,599
the 2017 where you know we've got

1317
00:50:08,549 --> 00:50:07,119
mars landers

1318
00:50:10,870 --> 00:50:08,559
people are talking about going back to

1319
00:50:13,109 --> 00:50:10,880
the moon and stuff so why perpetuate it

1320
00:50:15,190 --> 00:50:13,119
why not um

1321
00:50:16,790 --> 00:50:15,200
basically i don't mean necessarily walk

1322
00:50:18,870 --> 00:50:16,800
out on the stage and go okay guys you

1323
00:50:20,549 --> 00:50:18,880
know here's a story but at least

1324
00:50:23,030 --> 00:50:20,559
leak out

1325
00:50:25,030 --> 00:50:23,040
the necessary information so that it's

1326
00:50:27,670 --> 00:50:25,040
out in the open and that we can have an

1327
00:50:31,030 --> 00:50:27,680
honest debate and discussion why

1328
00:50:33,109 --> 00:50:31,040
well i think one primary reason is what

1329
00:50:34,710 --> 00:50:33,119
i mentioned before about technology

1330
00:50:36,710 --> 00:50:34,720
every air force would like to be able to

1331
00:50:38,150 --> 00:50:36,720
duplicate the flying characteristics of

1332
00:50:41,190 --> 00:50:38,160
a flying saucer

1333
00:50:44,630 --> 00:50:41,200
right up down back forth silence

1334
00:50:47,109 --> 00:50:44,640
right very high speed uh etc etc

1335
00:50:48,390 --> 00:50:47,119
well we can't put out on the table what

1336
00:50:50,950 --> 00:50:48,400
we know

1337
00:50:52,710 --> 00:50:50,960
if our enemies don't put out what they

1338
00:50:55,349 --> 00:50:52,720
know why should we give them what we

1339
00:50:56,630 --> 00:50:55,359
have and they all give us what they have

1340
00:51:00,710 --> 00:50:56,640
secondly

1341
00:51:02,390 --> 00:51:00,720
there is real concern on this planet

1342
00:51:04,549 --> 00:51:02,400
we don't know how to make the transition

1343
00:51:06,950 --> 00:51:04,559
from a nationalistically oriented planet

1344
00:51:08,549 --> 00:51:06,960
what do we i don't know 195 countries i

1345
00:51:11,510 --> 00:51:08,559
don't know what the latest number is but

1346
00:51:12,790 --> 00:51:11,520
it's it's it's a number close to 200.

1347
00:51:14,710 --> 00:51:12,800
uh

1348
00:51:17,109 --> 00:51:14,720
there is no earthling

1349
00:51:18,230 --> 00:51:17,119
control system

1350
00:51:19,990 --> 00:51:18,240
uh

1351
00:51:22,870 --> 00:51:20,000
you know people in power want to stay in

1352
00:51:25,030 --> 00:51:22,880
power yeah that's true and a lot of

1353
00:51:26,950 --> 00:51:25,040
people derive a lot of pleasure from

1354
00:51:29,190 --> 00:51:26,960
having the power of being headed or a

1355
00:51:29,990 --> 00:51:29,200
big shot in a country

1356
00:51:31,109 --> 00:51:30,000
so

1357
00:51:32,790 --> 00:51:31,119
you know

1358
00:51:34,630 --> 00:51:32,800
the fact that we have a skewed up

1359
00:51:36,710 --> 00:51:34,640
screwed up system

1360
00:51:39,190 --> 00:51:36,720
look the military budget this year last

1361
00:51:40,470 --> 00:51:39,200
year was a trillion dollars that's for

1362
00:51:41,910 --> 00:51:40,480
planet earth

1363
00:51:43,829 --> 00:51:41,920
united states about half of that

1364
00:51:45,589 --> 00:51:43,839
incidentally

1365
00:51:48,069 --> 00:51:45,599
uh

1366
00:51:49,750 --> 00:51:48,079
how do we go from that to a world

1367
00:51:52,230 --> 00:51:49,760
government

1368
00:51:53,430 --> 00:51:52,240
we don't know how to do that

1369
00:51:56,230 --> 00:51:53,440
you know how many kids died of

1370
00:51:58,309 --> 00:51:56,240
starvation last year oh yeah

1371
00:52:00,390 --> 00:51:58,319
we don't give a damn we got

1372
00:52:02,870 --> 00:52:00,400
a trillion we earthlings have a trillion

1373
00:52:04,710 --> 00:52:02,880
dollars worth of military going on

1374
00:52:07,349 --> 00:52:04,720
that's crazy

1375
00:52:09,670 --> 00:52:07,359
so we we are also there's a religious

1376
00:52:12,470 --> 00:52:09,680
side of the story too

1377
00:52:14,309 --> 00:52:12,480
uh i've had people ask me did jesus die

1378
00:52:15,270 --> 00:52:14,319
to save them

1379
00:52:16,950 --> 00:52:15,280
uh

1380
00:52:18,549 --> 00:52:16,960
and what if not

1381
00:52:20,630 --> 00:52:18,559
i've talked to fundamentalists who

1382
00:52:23,750 --> 00:52:20,640
insist that uh the world was created in

1383
00:52:24,710 --> 00:52:23,760
4004 bc on a thursday afternoon i think

1384
00:52:25,670 --> 00:52:24,720
it was

1385
00:52:26,870 --> 00:52:25,680
uh

1386
00:52:28,230 --> 00:52:26,880
well

1387
00:52:29,670 --> 00:52:28,240
who you know

1388
00:52:31,190 --> 00:52:29,680
are

1389
00:52:33,109 --> 00:52:31,200
totally

1390
00:52:35,589 --> 00:52:33,119
one that was it was a jerry falwell like

1391
00:52:37,030 --> 00:52:35,599
i said that all the intelligent life in

1392
00:52:37,910 --> 00:52:37,040
the universe is right here on planet

1393
00:52:40,069 --> 00:52:37,920
earth

1394
00:52:40,790 --> 00:52:40,079
oh man i hope not

1395
00:52:43,030 --> 00:52:40,800
well

1396
00:52:45,109 --> 00:52:43,040
yeah let's hope the good lord can do

1397
00:52:47,670 --> 00:52:45,119
better than that but

1398
00:52:52,069 --> 00:52:47,680
no kidding but what i'm saying is we're

1399
00:52:55,190 --> 00:52:52,079
not very good at transitioning

1400
00:52:57,589 --> 00:52:55,200
from one situation to a very very

1401
00:52:59,109 --> 00:52:57,599
different situation

1402
00:53:01,910 --> 00:52:59,119
and so

1403
00:53:03,510 --> 00:53:01,920
you know where do we go from here and

1404
00:53:05,349 --> 00:53:03,520
i'm not saying we in the russians

1405
00:53:07,670 --> 00:53:05,359
haven't and chinese haven't exchanged

1406
00:53:10,069 --> 00:53:07,680
information maybe we have

1407
00:53:13,670 --> 00:53:10,079
for all i know it's possible

1408
00:53:15,109 --> 00:53:13,680
but we we have a planet in trouble

1409
00:53:16,790 --> 00:53:15,119
on the one hand we're growing we're

1410
00:53:18,230 --> 00:53:16,800
getting smarter

1411
00:53:20,309 --> 00:53:18,240
on the other hand you have to say how

1412
00:53:22,390 --> 00:53:20,319
stupid can you get to spend all your

1413
00:53:24,390 --> 00:53:22,400
resources that way

1414
00:53:26,230 --> 00:53:24,400
instead of feeding those starving kids

1415
00:53:27,829 --> 00:53:26,240
you know well yeah and if

1416
00:53:29,910 --> 00:53:27,839
if you look at history whenever we've

1417
00:53:32,870 --> 00:53:29,920
had a technological breakthrough whether

1418
00:53:33,589 --> 00:53:32,880
it's uh the airplane or the automobile

1419
00:53:34,950 --> 00:53:33,599
or

1420
00:53:37,270 --> 00:53:34,960
uh

1421
00:53:38,870 --> 00:53:37,280
internet or whatever we have a tendency

1422
00:53:40,230 --> 00:53:38,880
to weaponize it

1423
00:53:41,670 --> 00:53:40,240
okay you're right

1424
00:53:43,510 --> 00:53:41,680
we split the atom and the first thing we

1425
00:53:44,950 --> 00:53:43,520
did is make a bomb out of it

1426
00:53:46,870 --> 00:53:44,960
i i mean

1427
00:53:47,829 --> 00:53:46,880
what else would you do

1428
00:53:51,270 --> 00:53:47,839
yeah

1429
00:53:54,470 --> 00:53:51,280
you know that

1430
00:53:56,470 --> 00:53:54,480
that type of uh

1431
00:53:59,030 --> 00:53:56,480
technology i guess or that type of

1432
00:54:00,630 --> 00:53:59,040
mindset is what i was looking for

1433
00:54:02,630 --> 00:54:00,640
yeah that you know but we're going to

1434
00:54:04,549 --> 00:54:02,640
take this technology and and we're going

1435
00:54:06,069 --> 00:54:04,559
to put it into the military industrial

1436
00:54:08,470 --> 00:54:06,079
complex and

1437
00:54:10,710 --> 00:54:08,480
and therefore we can crush our enemies

1438
00:54:13,270 --> 00:54:10,720
uh that much faster and that much

1439
00:54:14,630 --> 00:54:13,280
thoroughly and and that's a sad state of

1440
00:54:16,230 --> 00:54:14,640
affairs really when you stop and think

1441
00:54:18,150 --> 00:54:16,240
about it

1442
00:54:21,910 --> 00:54:18,160
we're at this stage that we have the

1443
00:54:24,950 --> 00:54:21,920
ability uh probably to

1444
00:54:27,589 --> 00:54:24,960
solve the starvation problem probably be

1445
00:54:31,510 --> 00:54:27,599
able to conquer a lot of diseases

1446
00:54:33,990 --> 00:54:31,520
okay if we put our if we put our uh our

1447
00:54:35,990 --> 00:54:34,000
resources on it but

1448
00:54:38,549 --> 00:54:36,000
when you spend

1449
00:54:41,750 --> 00:54:38,559
a third or maybe half of your uh

1450
00:54:44,549 --> 00:54:41,760
uh budget in uh weaponizing uh the

1451
00:54:46,309 --> 00:54:44,559
technology you're not going to do it

1452
00:54:48,390 --> 00:54:46,319
and that's the scare i mean we we just

1453
00:54:50,150 --> 00:54:48,400
what built an aircraft carrier 13

1454
00:54:51,990 --> 00:54:50,160
billion dollars

1455
00:54:54,870 --> 00:54:52,000
is what is that what that one cost uh

1456
00:54:57,750 --> 00:54:54,880
yeah the gerald ford the uss general

1457
00:54:59,349 --> 00:54:57,760
yeah um 13 billion dollars

1458
00:55:00,950 --> 00:54:59,359
and i just kind of shook my head because

1459
00:55:02,390 --> 00:55:00,960
i'm one of those people that think that

1460
00:55:04,309 --> 00:55:02,400
the aircraft carrier is going by the

1461
00:55:07,270 --> 00:55:04,319
wayside like the battleship i think it's

1462
00:55:10,790 --> 00:55:07,280
uh it's a dinosaur and and it'll be

1463
00:55:12,710 --> 00:55:10,800
proven to be um not the uh

1464
00:55:15,030 --> 00:55:12,720
my my father-in-law

1465
00:55:17,030 --> 00:55:15,040
uh he's deceased now but he was a

1466
00:55:21,510 --> 00:55:17,040
nuclear submarine commander he commanded

1467
00:55:23,510 --> 00:55:21,520
the uss pogey and he told me that the

1468
00:55:26,870 --> 00:55:23,520
most dangerous weapon platform on the

1469
00:55:27,750 --> 00:55:26,880
planet bar none is the submarine

1470
00:55:32,230 --> 00:55:27,760
and

1471
00:55:35,910 --> 00:55:32,240
when we were having this because you

1472
00:55:38,230 --> 00:55:35,920
can't find them you understand well yeah

1473
00:55:40,549 --> 00:55:38,240
and and not only that but he back in the

1474
00:55:42,549 --> 00:55:40,559
90s i mean he was retired from the u.s

1475
00:55:44,390 --> 00:55:42,559
navy and but we got into this discussion

1476
00:55:46,870 --> 00:55:44,400
he's he he's the one that said the

1477
00:55:49,430 --> 00:55:46,880
aircraft carrier is a dinosaur

1478
00:55:51,589 --> 00:55:49,440
and i go uh uh

1479
00:55:53,510 --> 00:55:51,599
really george and he goes oh yeah he

1480
00:55:55,510 --> 00:55:53,520
said we can find the aircraft carrier

1481
00:55:57,910 --> 00:55:55,520
anytime we want he says but we can't

1482
00:55:59,829 --> 00:55:57,920
find that submarine anytime we want

1483
00:56:01,990 --> 00:55:59,839
exactly right but there is another part

1484
00:56:04,470 --> 00:56:02,000
of that remember that the aircraft

1485
00:56:07,510 --> 00:56:04,480
carrier can operate for 18 years without

1486
00:56:09,589 --> 00:56:07,520
refueling right he's right

1487
00:56:12,069 --> 00:56:09,599
and when you're a sea captain being able

1488
00:56:14,470 --> 00:56:12,079
to forget about the gas tank

1489
00:56:15,670 --> 00:56:14,480
is a very big thing because you can go

1490
00:56:18,150 --> 00:56:15,680
full speed

1491
00:56:20,470 --> 00:56:18,160
now forever that's but that's true with

1492
00:56:23,190 --> 00:56:20,480
the submarine i mean oh yes the

1493
00:56:26,069 --> 00:56:23,200
submarine is uh oh i'm not knocking the

1494
00:56:27,990 --> 00:56:26,079
nuclear submarine the fact that

1495
00:56:31,589 --> 00:56:28,000
nobody knows where it is

1496
00:56:33,910 --> 00:56:31,599
so mutually assured destruction

1497
00:56:35,990 --> 00:56:33,920
i'll get back at you buddy that's right

1498
00:56:37,990 --> 00:56:36,000
yeah and you know with the with the

1499
00:56:40,309 --> 00:56:38,000
technology i i just

1500
00:56:41,430 --> 00:56:40,319
read an article mj here about uh three

1501
00:56:43,910 --> 00:56:41,440
days ago

1502
00:56:45,910 --> 00:56:43,920
the russians are planning on building a

1503
00:56:47,030 --> 00:56:45,920
30 000

1504
00:56:50,069 --> 00:56:47,040
um

1505
00:56:53,190 --> 00:56:50,079
division company of robots they want 30

1506
00:56:54,150 --> 00:56:53,200
000 battle hard robots

1507
00:56:57,829 --> 00:56:54,160
yeah

1508
00:56:59,589 --> 00:56:57,839
and uh and and i'm you know i'm one of

1509
00:57:01,349 --> 00:56:59,599
those that i think that uh you know it's

1510
00:57:02,950 --> 00:57:01,359
going to come to pass i mean

1511
00:57:05,030 --> 00:57:02,960
computers and robots as like peanut

1512
00:57:06,470 --> 00:57:05,040
butter and jelly or beer and pizza they

1513
00:57:08,549 --> 00:57:06,480
just go together

1514
00:57:11,190 --> 00:57:08,559
and and the military is not going to

1515
00:57:12,710 --> 00:57:11,200
pass up an opportunity to weaponize that

1516
00:57:13,910 --> 00:57:12,720
technology all we have to do is look at

1517
00:57:15,589 --> 00:57:13,920
the drones

1518
00:57:17,270 --> 00:57:15,599
gentlemen using that gentleman guess

1519
00:57:19,349 --> 00:57:17,280
what we we did miss our first break

1520
00:57:20,950 --> 00:57:19,359
because the discussion was just too good

1521
00:57:22,150 --> 00:57:20,960
to cut off but we're going to take one

1522
00:57:23,990 --> 00:57:22,160
take a five minute break you're

1523
00:57:25,430 --> 00:57:24,000
listening to stat and freeman tonight on

1524
00:57:29,990 --> 00:57:25,440
paying radio heard on the inception

1525
00:57:35,349 --> 00:57:32,309
welcome back to paying radio tonight we

1526
00:57:36,789 --> 00:57:35,359
have on the man himself the king um he

1527
00:57:38,630 --> 00:57:36,799
looks a little like elvis he's got a

1528
00:57:40,470 --> 00:57:38,640
beard maybe sort of a beard but stanton

1529
00:57:43,430 --> 00:57:40,480
freeman's with us tonight we thank him

1530
00:57:45,349 --> 00:57:43,440
for being on well stan um another

1531
00:57:47,430 --> 00:57:45,359
another good good case with a lot of

1532
00:57:48,789 --> 00:57:47,440
good evidence is shag harbor are you

1533
00:57:50,230 --> 00:57:48,799
close to shag harbor how far are you

1534
00:57:53,270 --> 00:57:50,240
away

1535
00:57:55,589 --> 00:57:53,280
well it's uh let's see over over a

1536
00:57:56,710 --> 00:57:55,599
four-hour drive okay

1537
00:58:02,230 --> 00:57:56,720
okay

1538
00:58:05,270 --> 00:58:02,240
i've talked to some of the witnesses and

1539
00:58:07,430 --> 00:58:05,280
it's a good case uh

1540
00:58:09,430 --> 00:58:07,440
partly because

1541
00:58:10,950 --> 00:58:09,440
the rcmp the royal canadian mounted

1542
00:58:12,390 --> 00:58:10,960
police got involved right after it

1543
00:58:14,470 --> 00:58:12,400
happened there were witnesses to the

1544
00:58:16,710 --> 00:58:14,480
darn thing going down in the water and

1545
00:58:18,230 --> 00:58:16,720
they thought it was an airplane

1546
00:58:20,150 --> 00:58:18,240
you know so we got to do something to

1547
00:58:21,510 --> 00:58:20,160
save the poor people in the airplane

1548
00:58:24,309 --> 00:58:21,520
that are going to drown in all that

1549
00:58:26,390 --> 00:58:24,319
water you know right and so they were on

1550
00:58:29,829 --> 00:58:26,400
site very quickly

1551
00:58:30,950 --> 00:58:29,839
and uh it didn't find any airplane and

1552
00:58:33,030 --> 00:58:30,960
stuff and

1553
00:58:34,549 --> 00:58:33,040
it was a good case there there was a

1554
00:58:37,109 --> 00:58:34,559
there's a sensitive element there

1555
00:58:40,069 --> 00:58:37,119
because that's an area south south

1556
00:58:41,430 --> 00:58:40,079
border of nova scotia there

1557
00:58:44,630 --> 00:58:41,440
where

1558
00:58:45,750 --> 00:58:44,640
the russian submarines go by and other

1559
00:58:47,030 --> 00:58:45,760
places

1560
00:58:48,789 --> 00:58:47,040
other

1561
00:58:50,789 --> 00:58:48,799
military craft

1562
00:58:52,950 --> 00:58:50,799
and so it's not a place that we like to

1563
00:58:55,829 --> 00:58:52,960
talk a lot about either government the

1564
00:58:56,870 --> 00:58:55,839
united states or uh canada

1565
00:58:58,150 --> 00:58:56,880
uh

1566
00:59:00,470 --> 00:58:58,160
and so

1567
00:59:02,630 --> 00:59:00,480
they didn't find something but i the

1568
00:59:04,789 --> 00:59:02,640
witnesses of course were younger and so

1569
00:59:06,630 --> 00:59:04,799
and many of them are still around

1570
00:59:09,589 --> 00:59:06,640
i'm satisfied they now they don't have a

1571
00:59:11,990 --> 00:59:09,599
good museum there right much of them

1572
00:59:13,589 --> 00:59:12,000
it's unlike roswell i was there three

1573
00:59:15,990 --> 00:59:13,599
weeks ago and uh

1574
00:59:18,309 --> 00:59:16,000
my goodness there were over 7000

1575
00:59:19,670 --> 00:59:18,319
visitors to roswell

1576
00:59:21,589 --> 00:59:19,680
uh

1577
00:59:22,950 --> 00:59:21,599
and considering that roswell's in the

1578
00:59:24,390 --> 00:59:22,960
middle of nowhere

1579
00:59:26,549 --> 00:59:24,400
all right right

1580
00:59:29,270 --> 00:59:26,559
it's not on the way to anywhere

1581
00:59:32,230 --> 00:59:29,280
i sold all my books uh

1582
00:59:33,589 --> 00:59:32,240
it's a proof that the people from all

1583
00:59:37,109 --> 00:59:33,599
over the world are interested because

1584
00:59:40,470 --> 00:59:38,710
and so

1585
00:59:42,150 --> 00:59:40,480
the shack arbor isn't like that it

1586
00:59:44,549 --> 00:59:42,160
doesn't have that kind of attractive

1587
00:59:46,549 --> 00:59:44,559
power and it doesn't have the freedom

1588
00:59:48,710 --> 00:59:46,559
uh for some of the discussions that have

1589
00:59:50,710 --> 00:59:48,720
taken place uh

1590
00:59:53,270 --> 00:59:50,720
because of like i say the sensitive

1591
00:59:55,589 --> 00:59:53,280
underwater uh all that sort of stuff but

1592
00:59:58,309 --> 00:59:55,599
uh no it's a good case and

1593
01:00:02,069 --> 00:59:58,319
look the the aztec case is an excellent

1594
01:00:04,069 --> 01:00:02,079
yeah scott suzanne radzi about that

1595
01:00:06,309 --> 01:00:04,079
uh they dug out all kinds of information

1596
01:00:07,510 --> 01:00:06,319
that nobody had before them

1597
01:00:08,870 --> 01:00:07,520
apparently

1598
01:00:11,270 --> 01:00:08,880
it's one of the factors that get into

1599
01:00:13,750 --> 01:00:11,280
these cases suzanne

1600
01:00:15,109 --> 01:00:13,760
his family is from around there

1601
01:00:17,750 --> 01:00:15,119
so

1602
01:00:18,870 --> 01:00:17,760
people don't aren't as ready in small

1603
01:00:22,069 --> 01:00:18,880
towns

1604
01:00:23,670 --> 01:00:22,079
to talk to strangers

1605
01:00:26,150 --> 01:00:23,680
but if you've got family and you know

1606
01:00:28,789 --> 01:00:26,160
people that it's much easier to get them

1607
01:00:30,789 --> 01:00:28,799
to talk so they found witnesses they

1608
01:00:31,910 --> 01:00:30,799
found a lot of stuff that nobody else

1609
01:00:34,150 --> 01:00:31,920
had found

1610
01:00:35,910 --> 01:00:34,160
but there was a crash in the plains of

1611
01:00:37,190 --> 01:00:35,920
san agustin

1612
01:00:41,349 --> 01:00:37,200
uh

1613
01:00:45,589 --> 01:00:44,150
there have been crash saucers

1614
01:00:48,230 --> 01:00:45,599
many of them

1615
01:00:50,950 --> 01:00:48,240
well you know one of the uh things i run

1616
01:00:52,549 --> 01:00:50,960
into a lot when i uh talk and discuss

1617
01:00:54,549 --> 01:00:52,559
with people and they they kind of roll

1618
01:00:56,470 --> 01:00:54,559
their eyes and they go come on ken they

1619
01:00:58,549 --> 01:00:56,480
have the technology to come here and

1620
01:01:00,069 --> 01:00:58,559
then they get here and what happens

1621
01:01:01,750 --> 01:01:00,079
they crash

1622
01:01:03,270 --> 01:01:01,760
and i look at them and i said well let

1623
01:01:04,470 --> 01:01:03,280
me ask you something

1624
01:01:06,230 --> 01:01:04,480
how long do you think we've been

1625
01:01:08,230 --> 01:01:06,240
building boats

1626
01:01:11,109 --> 01:01:08,240
i said i think we've got it down pretty

1627
01:01:13,270 --> 01:01:11,119
pretty good that uh we know how to build

1628
01:01:15,910 --> 01:01:13,280
a boat and and keep it afloat but i said

1629
01:01:17,910 --> 01:01:15,920
they still sink oh yeah oh yeah can like

1630
01:01:20,309 --> 01:01:17,920
interior sucked up many of them like

1631
01:01:22,150 --> 01:01:20,319
more oh yeah yeah yeah and

1632
01:01:24,069 --> 01:01:22,160
and you know i said you know we've been

1633
01:01:27,190 --> 01:01:24,079
flying for a little over a hundred years

1634
01:01:29,190 --> 01:01:27,200
i said i i think we understand lyft and

1635
01:01:31,270 --> 01:01:29,200
and how the aircraft works but i said

1636
01:01:32,950 --> 01:01:31,280
they still crash

1637
01:01:35,910 --> 01:01:32,960
you know i said so what makes you think

1638
01:01:37,430 --> 01:01:35,920
that you know they're not infallible

1639
01:01:39,270 --> 01:01:37,440
okay i mean they

1640
01:01:41,589 --> 01:01:39,280
whoever or whatever

1641
01:01:43,910 --> 01:01:41,599
um you know if it's a machine at some

1642
01:01:46,789 --> 01:01:43,920
point in time it has the possibility of

1643
01:01:48,630 --> 01:01:46,799
of breaking down or you know in our case

1644
01:01:50,470 --> 01:01:48,640
pilot error i mean what makes you think

1645
01:01:56,309 --> 01:01:50,480
that they're so perfect that they don't

1646
01:02:01,270 --> 01:01:58,390
i think that there was probably a

1647
01:02:03,030 --> 01:02:01,280
mid-air collision

1648
01:02:05,589 --> 01:02:03,040
you're listening to love advice with

1649
01:02:07,670 --> 01:02:05,599
leanne caller you're on the air uh hi

1650
01:02:08,710 --> 01:02:07,680
leanne long time listener first time

1651
01:02:10,630 --> 01:02:08,720
caller

1652
01:02:12,789 --> 01:02:10,640
why in your professional opinion do you

1653
01:02:13,910 --> 01:02:12,799
never take my calls off the air is this

1654
01:02:18,549 --> 01:02:13,920
carl

1655
01:02:21,589 --> 01:02:18,559
everything was great i thought uh well

1656
01:02:22,950 --> 01:02:21,599
you know when you switch to geico you

1657
01:02:25,430 --> 01:02:22,960
could save a lot of money on car

1658
01:02:28,390 --> 01:02:25,440
insurance okay awesome you should call

1659
01:02:30,230 --> 01:02:28,400
them i will geico because saving 15 or

1660
01:02:32,630 --> 01:02:30,240
more on car insurance is always the

1661
01:02:34,390 --> 01:02:32,640
great answer planes of san agustin and

1662
01:02:37,030 --> 01:02:34,400
roswell that

1663
01:02:38,470 --> 01:02:37,040
i found that there was a radar set on

1664
01:02:40,470 --> 01:02:38,480
because they were going to launch from

1665
01:02:43,510 --> 01:02:40,480
uh white sands

1666
01:02:46,309 --> 01:02:43,520
and back those days guys they were

1667
01:02:48,870 --> 01:02:46,319
vacuum tube radar systems

1668
01:02:51,829 --> 01:02:48,880
and you had to leave them on

1669
01:02:53,349 --> 01:02:51,839
otherwise you got a warm-up time

1670
01:02:55,589 --> 01:02:53,359
and so here you are in the middle of

1671
01:02:57,910 --> 01:02:55,599
nowhere and you've got a pilot and a

1672
01:03:00,470 --> 01:02:57,920
wingman aliens of course

1673
01:03:02,390 --> 01:03:00,480
and they come across this damn radar

1674
01:03:04,309 --> 01:03:02,400
beam that's sitting out there well you

1675
01:03:06,870 --> 01:03:04,319
know that's rotating you've brought that

1676
01:03:09,109 --> 01:03:06,880
up ken i mean as a theory yeah

1677
01:03:10,549 --> 01:03:09,119
my my uh

1678
01:03:12,630 --> 01:03:10,559
let me

1679
01:03:15,029 --> 01:03:12,640
dovetail here a little quick on that

1680
01:03:16,950 --> 01:03:15,039
um i asked my father-in-law i said you

1681
01:03:19,029 --> 01:03:16,960
know george i said uh when you're

1682
01:03:20,309 --> 01:03:19,039
underwater did you ever track any

1683
01:03:22,230 --> 01:03:20,319
unknowns

1684
01:03:23,670 --> 01:03:22,240
and he got a real serious look at him he

1685
01:03:25,589 --> 01:03:23,680
said all the time and that's all i'm

1686
01:03:26,470 --> 01:03:25,599
going to say about it and he knew he

1687
01:03:28,710 --> 01:03:26,480
knew where

1688
01:03:31,589 --> 01:03:28,720
where i was coming from and one day i'm

1689
01:03:33,270 --> 01:03:31,599
at the house they he would retire there

1690
01:03:34,150 --> 01:03:33,280
on the island of oahu and i'm sitting on

1691
01:03:36,069 --> 01:03:34,160
the beach

1692
01:03:37,270 --> 01:03:36,079
looking at the bikinis walking by on the

1693
01:03:39,589 --> 01:03:37,280
on the beat

1694
01:03:41,430 --> 01:03:39,599
and not that i would do that but all of

1695
01:03:43,430 --> 01:03:41,440
a sudden he walks up behind me and he

1696
01:03:45,750 --> 01:03:43,440
hands me a book

1697
01:03:47,510 --> 01:03:45,760
he goes the book stays in the house but

1698
01:03:49,910 --> 01:03:47,520
he said it was written by my academy

1699
01:03:51,750 --> 01:03:49,920
classmate he said the navy

1700
01:03:54,150 --> 01:03:51,760
tried to keep him from publishing it and

1701
01:03:56,069 --> 01:03:54,160
at that time it was still

1702
01:03:57,829 --> 01:03:56,079
being argued in the courts

1703
01:03:59,430 --> 01:03:57,839
but he had he had one of the original

1704
01:04:01,670 --> 01:03:59,440
copies and he says i think you'll find

1705
01:04:03,990 --> 01:04:01,680
chapter 11 interesting

1706
01:04:06,390 --> 01:04:04,000
so i went right to chapter 11 and and

1707
01:04:08,470 --> 01:04:06,400
what it was about was the navy

1708
01:04:11,029 --> 01:04:08,480
during world war ii

1709
01:04:14,630 --> 01:04:11,039
the japanese had a nasty habit

1710
01:04:17,510 --> 01:04:14,640
of popping out behind thunderstorms and

1711
01:04:19,829 --> 01:04:17,520
engaging the u.s navy and in the battle

1712
01:04:22,870 --> 01:04:19,839
of okinawa the navy had to put

1713
01:04:25,029 --> 01:04:22,880
destroyers out every 26 miles

1714
01:04:26,950 --> 01:04:25,039
because the kamikazes would fly under

1715
01:04:29,190 --> 01:04:26,960
the curve because of the curvature of

1716
01:04:30,950 --> 01:04:29,200
the of the planet would fly under the

1717
01:04:33,349 --> 01:04:30,960
radar beam and then at the last moment

1718
01:04:36,630 --> 01:04:33,359
they would pop up and dive bomb into the

1719
01:04:39,510 --> 01:04:36,640
ship so the navy was trying to develop

1720
01:04:41,990 --> 01:04:39,520
over the horizon radar

1721
01:04:43,430 --> 01:04:42,000
and and they were trying to see if they

1722
01:04:46,390 --> 01:04:43,440
could pierce

1723
01:04:50,230 --> 01:04:46,400
uh thunderstorms and staten guess where

1724
01:04:54,390 --> 01:04:52,630
white sands new mexico oh

1725
01:04:56,390 --> 01:04:54,400
i should have known of course

1726
01:04:58,470 --> 01:04:56,400
yeah and and

1727
01:05:01,109 --> 01:04:58,480
you know for for him to tell me i think

1728
01:05:03,589 --> 01:05:01,119
it made me think that maybe because if

1729
01:05:06,150 --> 01:05:03,599
i'm if i'm right there was a

1730
01:05:08,630 --> 01:05:06,160
horrendous electrical storm

1731
01:05:09,829 --> 01:05:08,640
that was moving across new mexico into

1732
01:05:12,950 --> 01:05:09,839
texas

1733
01:05:14,789 --> 01:05:12,960
uh in july of that year and i could just

1734
01:05:17,270 --> 01:05:14,799
see the navy turning on their high

1735
01:05:19,829 --> 01:05:17,280
potency uh microwave radar to see if

1736
01:05:21,349 --> 01:05:19,839
they could penetrate that thunderstorm

1737
01:05:22,710 --> 01:05:21,359
and they didn't know that there was two

1738
01:05:24,470 --> 01:05:22,720
craft up there

1739
01:05:26,789 --> 01:05:24,480
and yeah you know

1740
01:05:28,870 --> 01:05:26,799
i love it i think that

1741
01:05:31,430 --> 01:05:28,880
i i think that's so true because it's

1742
01:05:33,349 --> 01:05:31,440
the unexpected you know we can talk

1743
01:05:35,109 --> 01:05:33,359
about drones and robots and all this

1744
01:05:37,349 --> 01:05:35,119
kind of stuff but

1745
01:05:40,230 --> 01:05:37,359
behavior is still something we can't go

1746
01:05:41,109 --> 01:05:40,240
100 percent on things gonna happen you

1747
01:05:42,150 --> 01:05:41,119
know

1748
01:05:44,710 --> 01:05:42,160
and so

1749
01:05:46,549 --> 01:05:44,720
uh that's what you have to

1750
01:05:48,789 --> 01:05:46,559
look out for the fact that they can get

1751
01:05:50,069 --> 01:05:48,799
here from someplace else

1752
01:05:54,710 --> 01:05:50,079
doesn't mean that they don't spill

1753
01:05:59,270 --> 01:05:57,029
i don't know where that came from but no

1754
01:06:00,789 --> 01:05:59,280
but that's a that's a point well made i

1755
01:06:02,390 --> 01:06:00,799
mean we have a tendency to think that

1756
01:06:04,630 --> 01:06:02,400
just because they have a technological

1757
01:06:06,870 --> 01:06:04,640
leap on us that they're infallible and i

1758
01:06:09,990 --> 01:06:06,880
don't see that at all

1759
01:06:11,750 --> 01:06:10,000
no and we have weather on this planet we

1760
01:06:14,470 --> 01:06:11,760
this is not a planet which is able to

1761
01:06:18,069 --> 01:06:14,480
control its weather to avoid all kinds

1762
01:06:19,670 --> 01:06:18,079
of bad sequences of things happening

1763
01:06:21,349 --> 01:06:19,680
look at the hurricanes look at the

1764
01:06:22,630 --> 01:06:21,359
typhoons

1765
01:06:23,910 --> 01:06:22,640
uh you know

1766
01:06:25,589 --> 01:06:23,920
uh

1767
01:06:27,670 --> 01:06:25,599
everything happening at just the wrong

1768
01:06:29,990 --> 01:06:27,680
time you know whenever you're gonna take

1769
01:06:32,870 --> 01:06:30,000
off or land or whatever

1770
01:06:35,670 --> 01:06:32,880
so there are unpredictable things like

1771
01:06:40,549 --> 01:06:37,510
and and and to think for one minute that

1772
01:06:42,150 --> 01:06:40,559
that's not going to impact a uh uh alien

1773
01:06:44,069 --> 01:06:42,160
race that comes here

1774
01:06:45,430 --> 01:06:44,079
um it would be ludicrous i mean they

1775
01:06:47,670 --> 01:06:45,440
they would have to i'm going to answer

1776
01:06:48,710 --> 01:06:47,680
this phone for just a second yep go

1777
01:06:51,109 --> 01:06:48,720
ahead

1778
01:06:53,270 --> 01:06:51,119
that makes that's a good point ken

1779
01:06:56,789 --> 01:06:53,280
well yeah i just think that uh you know

1780
01:06:58,870 --> 01:06:56,799
to be able to to think you know for

1781
01:07:00,150 --> 01:06:58,880
i guess naysayers or

1782
01:07:01,750 --> 01:07:00,160
or are

1783
01:07:03,430 --> 01:07:01,760
skeptics to make that

1784
01:07:05,829 --> 01:07:03,440
to make that claim

1785
01:07:07,910 --> 01:07:05,839
just doesn't um doesn't hold water it

1786
01:07:09,589 --> 01:07:07,920
doesn't wash i mean because we're we're

1787
01:07:11,670 --> 01:07:09,599
making a big assumption that they're

1788
01:07:13,349 --> 01:07:11,680
infallible that they're perfect

1789
01:07:15,109 --> 01:07:13,359
yeah and of course we're not perfect by

1790
01:07:17,670 --> 01:07:15,119
any means you know that definitely well

1791
01:07:19,990 --> 01:07:17,680
hell no and and that their equipment is

1792
01:07:23,029 --> 01:07:20,000
not going to malfunction radio

1793
01:07:25,270 --> 01:07:23,039
so i just don't see how any of that uh

1794
01:07:26,870 --> 01:07:25,280
you know holds water when it comes to

1795
01:07:28,549 --> 01:07:26,880
you know wow when i come here for mans

1796
01:07:30,470 --> 01:07:28,559
of my we don't know that they come from

1797
01:07:32,390 --> 01:07:30,480
billions of miles away either right

1798
01:07:33,910 --> 01:07:32,400
right i mean they could be just outside

1799
01:07:35,910 --> 01:07:33,920
of our solar system like i said they

1800
01:07:38,069 --> 01:07:35,920
could be nomadic and like stanton said

1801
01:07:40,069 --> 01:07:38,079
that you know they've got a mother ship

1802
01:07:43,349 --> 01:07:40,079
and you know they're just a few hours

1803
01:07:44,950 --> 01:07:43,359
away by by flight at their craft and it

1804
01:07:47,029 --> 01:07:44,960
doesn't necessarily mean that their

1805
01:07:48,390 --> 01:07:47,039
technology is infallible that it doesn't

1806
01:07:49,510 --> 01:07:48,400
make mistakes

1807
01:07:50,870 --> 01:07:49,520
they're probably they're probably

1808
01:07:53,029 --> 01:07:50,880
building right inside the earth they've

1809
01:07:55,910 --> 01:07:53,039
been here for thousands of years and

1810
01:07:57,589 --> 01:07:55,920
sorry about that yeah that's okay stand

1811
01:07:59,750 --> 01:07:57,599
yeah we were just uh we were just

1812
01:08:01,589 --> 01:07:59,760
commenting on you know the fact that uh

1813
01:08:03,349 --> 01:08:01,599
that you know just because they have a

1814
01:08:04,630 --> 01:08:03,359
technological jump on us doesn't mean

1815
01:08:06,710 --> 01:08:04,640
that they don't make mistakes and that

1816
01:08:08,230 --> 01:08:06,720
their equipment doesn't break down

1817
01:08:11,029 --> 01:08:08,240
um

1818
01:08:12,309 --> 01:08:11,039
you know i mean it just doesn't i i

1819
01:08:13,990 --> 01:08:12,319
don't understand

1820
01:08:15,670 --> 01:08:14,000
how a person would make would really

1821
01:08:17,749 --> 01:08:15,680
believe that well i can't see them

1822
01:08:19,669 --> 01:08:17,759
coming all the way here and crashing

1823
01:08:21,590 --> 01:08:19,679
well we don't know we don't know what

1824
01:08:22,550 --> 01:08:21,600
the circumstances were that caused the

1825
01:08:27,669 --> 01:08:22,560
crash

1826
01:08:29,510 --> 01:08:27,679
very sophisticated system wasn't it

1827
01:08:30,550 --> 01:08:29,520
yeah yeah it was

1828
01:08:31,510 --> 01:08:30,560
oh yeah

1829
01:08:33,590 --> 01:08:31,520
hey

1830
01:08:34,630 --> 01:08:33,600
um you know you look at the uh the

1831
01:08:37,110 --> 01:08:34,640
thresher

1832
01:08:39,829 --> 01:08:37,120
the the submarine that went down back in

1833
01:08:41,990 --> 01:08:39,839
the 60s because of a water pipe

1834
01:08:44,550 --> 01:08:42,000
and and and it flooded the front of the

1835
01:08:46,709 --> 01:08:44,560
forward compartments and and uh you know

1836
01:08:49,269 --> 01:08:46,719
george my father-in-law said that they

1837
01:08:50,550 --> 01:08:49,279
didn't anticipate

1838
01:08:51,990 --> 01:08:50,560
on on

1839
01:08:53,910 --> 01:08:52,000
the the flooding of the forward

1840
01:08:55,669 --> 01:08:53,920
compartment when it was doing a test

1841
01:08:57,829 --> 01:08:55,679
dive when the water pump when the water

1842
01:08:59,749 --> 01:08:57,839
pipe broke they didn't have any shutoff

1843
01:09:02,070 --> 01:08:59,759
valves to shut the water off

1844
01:09:03,269 --> 01:09:02,080
it was an oversight on the on you know

1845
01:09:05,430 --> 01:09:03,279
architectural

1846
01:09:08,550 --> 01:09:05,440
table when they were drawing it up

1847
01:09:10,709 --> 01:09:08,560
so yeah i i don't know you know

1848
01:09:12,789 --> 01:09:10,719
we make mistakes why don't they

1849
01:09:14,709 --> 01:09:12,799
and so yeah i see their i see them

1850
01:09:17,669 --> 01:09:14,719
having the ability to crash

1851
01:09:19,669 --> 01:09:17,679
you know you bet i i don't uh for a

1852
01:09:20,789 --> 01:09:19,679
minute think that that's not a plausible

1853
01:09:22,870 --> 01:09:20,799
explanation

1854
01:09:24,070 --> 01:09:22,880
that they're not that that they're

1855
01:09:25,189 --> 01:09:24,080
perfect

1856
01:09:27,829 --> 01:09:25,199
no

1857
01:09:29,030 --> 01:09:27,839
i agree with you uh and and

1858
01:09:31,430 --> 01:09:29,040
you know

1859
01:09:32,229 --> 01:09:31,440
but what we have to worry about here is

1860
01:09:33,430 --> 01:09:32,239
that

1861
01:09:36,630 --> 01:09:33,440
there's been

1862
01:09:39,349 --> 01:09:36,640
the planet's 4 billion years old

1863
01:09:41,189 --> 01:09:39,359
the galaxies are at least 13 billion

1864
01:09:44,229 --> 01:09:41,199
years old

1865
01:09:46,630 --> 01:09:44,239
who knows what all has gone on we

1866
01:09:48,870 --> 01:09:46,640
haven't perfected

1867
01:09:51,349 --> 01:09:48,880
perfection yet

1868
01:09:53,030 --> 01:09:51,359
and i don't expect that they will

1869
01:09:53,829 --> 01:09:53,040
no i don't either right

1870
01:09:55,430 --> 01:09:53,839
you know

1871
01:09:57,590 --> 01:09:55,440
anybody who thinks there's there must be

1872
01:10:00,070 --> 01:09:57,600
a perfect planet out there

1873
01:10:02,310 --> 01:10:00,080
the essence of humanity is not

1874
01:10:04,870 --> 01:10:02,320
perfection it's being able to deal with

1875
01:10:06,229 --> 01:10:04,880
the problems that come along

1876
01:10:08,310 --> 01:10:06,239
right

1877
01:10:10,550 --> 01:10:08,320
that's i didn't mean that to sound so

1878
01:10:12,070 --> 01:10:10,560
profound how we adapted to the problems

1879
01:10:14,390 --> 01:10:12,080
yeah

1880
01:10:16,149 --> 01:10:15,270
look

1881
01:10:18,630 --> 01:10:16,159
uh

1882
01:10:21,430 --> 01:10:18,640
the the notion

1883
01:10:24,950 --> 01:10:21,440
if you deal with the debunkers you find

1884
01:10:27,830 --> 01:10:24,960
that none of them have solid cases

1885
01:10:29,030 --> 01:10:27,840
now i'm serious uh i've debated with

1886
01:10:32,950 --> 01:10:29,040
them

1887
01:10:34,870 --> 01:10:32,960
and they haven't done their homework

1888
01:10:37,669 --> 01:10:34,880
that's the first thing

1889
01:10:38,790 --> 01:10:37,679
oh i get it i get it

1890
01:10:40,950 --> 01:10:38,800
i know i was just gonna say i get

1891
01:10:43,430 --> 01:10:40,960
infuriated when i hear academia said

1892
01:10:46,310 --> 01:10:43,440
that there is no scientific evidence

1893
01:10:48,070 --> 01:10:46,320
to prove that flying saucers exist and i

1894
01:10:50,630 --> 01:10:48,080
just shake my head and i go well project

1895
01:10:53,430 --> 01:10:50,640
identification by professor harley

1896
01:10:55,430 --> 01:10:53,440
rutledge uh if you read

1897
01:10:58,149 --> 01:10:55,440
that was a pretty uh

1898
01:10:59,910 --> 01:10:58,159
back in the early 70s that was a pretty

1899
01:11:02,630 --> 01:10:59,920
scientific study

1900
01:11:04,149 --> 01:11:02,640
and he came away with the view that yeah

1901
01:11:06,310 --> 01:11:04,159
there's definitely some type of

1902
01:11:08,470 --> 01:11:06,320
technology that we're not familiar with

1903
01:11:10,070 --> 01:11:08,480
and the other thing is is radar a

1904
01:11:12,950 --> 01:11:10,080
scientific instrument

1905
01:11:14,870 --> 01:11:12,960
well of course it is and how many cases

1906
01:11:17,270 --> 01:11:14,880
do we have where you have not one not

1907
01:11:19,750 --> 01:11:17,280
two not three radar sightings but you

1908
01:11:21,189 --> 01:11:19,760
have a half a dozen all confirming that

1909
01:11:23,030 --> 01:11:21,199
there's an object on the sky and then

1910
01:11:24,310 --> 01:11:23,040
you have to rely on the pilot that's

1911
01:11:25,750 --> 01:11:24,320
telling you what they're seeing in the

1912
01:11:28,470 --> 01:11:25,760
quadrant of the sky where you told them

1913
01:11:32,310 --> 01:11:30,470
i i i just i i

1914
01:11:34,310 --> 01:11:32,320
i it it makes me

1915
01:11:35,020 --> 01:11:34,320
i get frustrated when i hear that i know

1916
01:11:37,510 --> 01:11:35,030
the feeling

1917
01:11:39,750 --> 01:11:37,520
[Laughter]

1918
01:11:42,790 --> 01:11:39,760
it's like holy cow are you serious you

1919
01:11:44,790 --> 01:11:42,800
know come on and well radar makes miss a

1920
01:11:46,709 --> 01:11:44,800
if radar was that infallible how come

1921
01:11:48,550 --> 01:11:46,719
we're using it how many planes are in

1922
01:11:51,750 --> 01:11:48,560
the air at any given minute

1923
01:11:54,950 --> 01:11:51,760
uh come on i mean i think we we we rely

1924
01:11:56,950 --> 01:11:54,960
on radar and the sophistication

1925
01:11:59,510 --> 01:11:56,960
of it i mean we do weather forecasting

1926
01:12:00,870 --> 01:11:59,520
off of it we we our air traffic control

1927
01:12:03,110 --> 01:12:00,880
is based on it

1928
01:12:05,590 --> 01:12:03,120
um i think it's we got it down pretty

1929
01:12:08,630 --> 01:12:05,600
good so i when the radar

1930
01:12:11,110 --> 01:12:08,640
ain't perfect man no no not at all

1931
01:12:13,270 --> 01:12:11,120
absolutely that's exactly right okay and

1932
01:12:16,390 --> 01:12:13,280
and there's another case where yep it

1933
01:12:17,350 --> 01:12:16,400
makes mistakes that's a fact

1934
01:12:20,310 --> 01:12:17,360
so

1935
01:12:21,590 --> 01:12:20,320
anyway i i just think that uh well let

1936
01:12:23,990 --> 01:12:21,600
me ask you something stan why do you

1937
01:12:26,390 --> 01:12:24,000
think academia is that way

1938
01:12:31,910 --> 01:12:29,830
why are they so anti uh such a skeptic

1939
01:12:34,149 --> 01:12:31,920
on the subject that they roll their eyes

1940
01:12:35,510 --> 01:12:34,159
and uh is it because of ridicule they're

1941
01:12:37,590 --> 01:12:35,520
afraid they're gonna lose their funding

1942
01:12:40,709 --> 01:12:37,600
or what certainly are some of them

1943
01:12:42,950 --> 01:12:40,719
there's a fear of ridicule when i ask my

1944
01:12:45,910 --> 01:12:42,960
audiences at the end of my lectures and

1945
01:12:47,669 --> 01:12:45,920
i've done over more than 700 so far i

1946
01:12:49,110 --> 01:12:47,679
usually ask at the end how many here

1947
01:12:50,870 --> 01:12:49,120
believe they've seen what i would

1948
01:12:52,790 --> 01:12:50,880
consider to be a flying saucer having

1949
01:12:55,270 --> 01:12:52,800
defined my terms earlier just raise your

1950
01:12:56,630 --> 01:12:55,280
hand i just point and count

1951
01:12:58,630 --> 01:12:56,640
and uh

1952
01:13:00,390 --> 01:12:58,640
i'm not asking your names or anything

1953
01:13:03,030 --> 01:13:00,400
and typically it's ten percent of the

1954
01:13:04,950 --> 01:13:03,040
audience much to their surprise

1955
01:13:06,950 --> 01:13:04,960
and then i ask uh how many of you

1956
01:13:09,189 --> 01:13:06,960
reported what you saw

1957
01:13:10,870 --> 01:13:09,199
ninety percent of the hands go down

1958
01:13:13,030 --> 01:13:10,880
anybody left uh how many of you were in

1959
01:13:15,350 --> 01:13:13,040
the military at the time and you want to

1960
01:13:17,750 --> 01:13:15,360
tell us about it one guy in front of

1961
01:13:19,510 --> 01:13:17,760
1300 in texas says i can't they told me

1962
01:13:21,830 --> 01:13:19,520
not to say anything which was a great

1963
01:13:22,950 --> 01:13:21,840
line

1964
01:13:25,510 --> 01:13:22,960
oh yeah so

1965
01:13:29,669 --> 01:13:25,520
right the interest is there the fear of

1966
01:13:30,790 --> 01:13:29,679
ridicule is there the academics also

1967
01:13:37,510 --> 01:13:30,800
i

1968
01:13:39,830 --> 01:13:37,520
and

1969
01:13:41,510 --> 01:13:39,840
they don't seem to i've got academics

1970
01:13:43,189 --> 01:13:41,520
who don't seem to think governments can

1971
01:13:45,669 --> 01:13:43,199
keep secrets

1972
01:13:48,070 --> 01:13:45,679
oh really today with the internet and

1973
01:13:50,430 --> 01:13:48,080
the youtube you can't keep anything

1974
01:13:51,990 --> 01:13:50,440
secret stan oh really

1975
01:13:54,310 --> 01:13:52,000
[Music]

1976
01:13:56,550 --> 01:13:54,320
you know how come lockheed was able to

1977
01:13:57,750 --> 01:13:56,560
spend 10 billion developing a stealth

1978
01:13:59,110 --> 01:13:57,760
aircraft

1979
01:14:01,430 --> 01:13:59,120
in secret

1980
01:14:04,870 --> 01:14:01,440
right how come our first spy satellite

1981
01:14:05,669 --> 01:14:04,880
the corona spy satellite loved the name

1982
01:14:07,270 --> 01:14:05,679
uh

1983
01:14:13,110 --> 01:14:07,280
and i'm sure it wasn't named after the

1984
01:14:17,270 --> 01:14:14,550
well you know

1985
01:14:18,709 --> 01:14:17,280
they they had 12 failures

1986
01:14:21,669 --> 01:14:18,719
in secret

1987
01:14:23,910 --> 01:14:21,679
the 13th one worked and got more data on

1988
01:14:26,630 --> 01:14:23,920
soviet military construction than all

1989
01:14:31,110 --> 01:14:26,640
the u2 flights that had preceded it

1990
01:14:32,790 --> 01:14:31,120
and yet it was kept secret for 30 years

1991
01:14:35,030 --> 01:14:32,800
what i loved about the corona the thing

1992
01:14:37,110 --> 01:14:35,040
that really caught my attention you know

1993
01:14:40,149 --> 01:14:37,120
how they got the film back

1994
01:14:42,070 --> 01:14:40,159
they deorbited the film canisters and

1995
01:14:43,510 --> 01:14:42,080
they were picked up by airplanes flying

1996
01:14:45,350 --> 01:14:43,520
over the pacific

1997
01:14:47,669 --> 01:14:45,360
oh wow put out the net guys here it

1998
01:14:48,709 --> 01:14:47,679
comes oh wow

1999
01:14:50,550 --> 01:14:48,719
stand up

2000
01:14:52,149 --> 01:14:50,560
for you stan we're getting close to the

2001
01:14:53,830 --> 01:14:52,159
end of town we gotta let you rest but we

2002
01:14:56,310 --> 01:14:53,840
have one question in chat if you don't

2003
01:14:59,510 --> 01:14:56,320
mind asking or me asking the question we

2004
01:15:01,830 --> 01:14:59,520
this is from neutron retyped by jb jim

2005
01:15:03,430 --> 01:15:01,840
bob shorter buddy question for stanton

2006
01:15:05,270 --> 01:15:03,440
did you ever research the story and

2007
01:15:07,830 --> 01:15:05,280
documents available at the canadian

2008
01:15:10,229 --> 01:15:07,840
national archives on canadian ufo

2009
01:15:12,630 --> 01:15:10,239
researcher wilbert smith and project

2010
01:15:15,510 --> 01:15:12,640
magnet in the 40s by the way i can tell

2011
01:15:17,669 --> 01:15:15,520
you the magnets he used to try to pull

2012
01:15:19,510 --> 01:15:17,679
the ufos are still down in the concrete

2013
01:15:22,630 --> 01:15:19,520
floor of one of the buildings today at

2014
01:15:25,350 --> 01:15:22,640
shirley's bay burley bay yeah yeah i've

2015
01:15:27,669 --> 01:15:25,360
been at the canadian files uh and i was

2016
01:15:28,790 --> 01:15:27,679
very glad to look at some of that stuff

2017
01:15:31,830 --> 01:15:28,800
uh

2018
01:15:35,910 --> 01:15:31,840
and i i admire wilbur smith i don't

2019
01:15:39,430 --> 01:15:35,920
degrade him uh as some people want to

2020
01:15:41,750 --> 01:15:39,440
uh he was interested in and crazy stuff

2021
01:15:44,070 --> 01:15:41,760
you know big deal

2022
01:15:46,070 --> 01:15:44,080
[Laughter]

2023
01:15:49,750 --> 01:15:46,080
yeah the canadian files were

2024
01:15:51,270 --> 01:15:49,760
i spent more time there early on uh

2025
01:15:53,270 --> 01:15:51,280
than in some of the us files i've been

2026
01:15:55,350 --> 01:15:53,280
to 20 archives

2027
01:15:57,189 --> 01:15:55,360
uh and fortunately i was able to get

2028
01:15:58,070 --> 01:15:57,199
some financial support to go to some of

2029
01:15:59,189 --> 01:15:58,080
them

2030
01:16:02,310 --> 01:15:59,199
because

2031
01:16:04,390 --> 01:16:02,320
you know i live on the eastern end of

2032
01:16:05,590 --> 01:16:04,400
canada

2033
01:16:07,510 --> 01:16:05,600
and

2034
01:16:10,790 --> 01:16:07,520
stuff isn't close but

2035
01:16:13,110 --> 01:16:10,800
yeah uh the canadian archives are are

2036
01:16:15,350 --> 01:16:13,120
worthwhile places uh

2037
01:16:17,910 --> 01:16:15,360
the eisenhower library i

2038
01:16:19,510 --> 01:16:17,920
i love archivists

2039
01:16:22,390 --> 01:16:19,520
and they keep you from getting into

2040
01:16:25,510 --> 01:16:22,400
trouble with foolish things uh

2041
01:16:27,270 --> 01:16:25,520
you know and i i check with them

2042
01:16:28,709 --> 01:16:27,280
i ask them questions and they're very

2043
01:16:29,830 --> 01:16:28,719
helpful

2044
01:16:30,790 --> 01:16:29,840
uh

2045
01:16:32,470 --> 01:16:30,800
about

2046
01:16:35,750 --> 01:16:32,480
well

2047
01:16:40,709 --> 01:16:38,790
what do you call it rank

2048
01:16:42,790 --> 01:16:40,719
uh i asked two different archivists i

2049
01:16:44,790 --> 01:16:42,800
said does it bother you is it no

2050
01:16:47,669 --> 01:16:44,800
standard practice to use

2051
01:16:50,630 --> 01:16:47,679
the uh you know the general or admiral

2052
01:16:52,790 --> 01:16:50,640
rather than the rear ride role or

2053
01:16:55,430 --> 01:16:52,800
regular general or whatever standard

2054
01:16:57,270 --> 01:16:55,440
practice they said ike used it

2055
01:16:58,790 --> 01:16:57,280
so i looked up in some of the books and

2056
01:17:00,229 --> 01:16:58,800
sure enough

2057
01:17:02,310 --> 01:17:00,239
and i looked at meeting notes from

2058
01:17:04,229 --> 01:17:02,320
mike's staff secretary of general who

2059
01:17:05,990 --> 01:17:04,239
called himself general even though he

2060
01:17:07,590 --> 01:17:06,000
was only a brigadier general he signed

2061
01:17:11,350 --> 01:17:07,600
brigadier general

2062
01:17:12,149 --> 01:17:11,360
but these guys can be very helpful

2063
01:17:13,189 --> 01:17:12,159
uh

2064
01:17:14,870 --> 01:17:13,199
you know

2065
01:17:17,270 --> 01:17:14,880
give him a chance

2066
01:17:18,390 --> 01:17:17,280
ask for elucidation of things if you

2067
01:17:21,669 --> 01:17:18,400
will

2068
01:17:24,070 --> 01:17:21,679
and so i i like archives and

2069
01:17:25,990 --> 01:17:24,080
i like documents

2070
01:17:28,229 --> 01:17:26,000
you know uh

2071
01:17:29,990 --> 01:17:28,239
that's the physicist in me i guess and

2072
01:17:31,510 --> 01:17:30,000
the fact that i had a clearance for 14

2073
01:17:33,590 --> 01:17:31,520
years

2074
01:17:35,030 --> 01:17:33,600
so uh and when somebody tells me well

2075
01:17:37,669 --> 01:17:35,040
they never would have done it that way

2076
01:17:39,110 --> 01:17:37,679
and date format on some of the uh mj

2077
01:17:40,229 --> 01:17:39,120
drop stuff

2078
01:17:42,870 --> 01:17:40,239
uh

2079
01:17:44,310 --> 01:17:42,880
and i i have one folder from the eisner

2080
01:17:46,470 --> 01:17:44,320
library that had seven different data

2081
01:17:48,390 --> 01:17:46,480
formats in it

2082
01:17:51,430 --> 01:17:48,400
and i get guys tell me though they only

2083
01:17:53,350 --> 01:17:51,440
use this one well it's not true

2084
01:17:55,510 --> 01:17:53,360
uh and so that's why i like to ask

2085
01:17:57,430 --> 01:17:55,520
archivists

2086
01:17:59,270 --> 01:17:57,440
you know and

2087
01:18:00,870 --> 01:17:59,280
they're helpful

2088
01:18:03,510 --> 01:18:00,880
they're people you respect for their

2089
01:18:05,590 --> 01:18:03,520
knowledge and experience and they're not

2090
01:18:07,110 --> 01:18:05,600
grinding an ax and i'm not grinding an

2091
01:18:09,830 --> 01:18:07,120
eye

2092
01:18:10,709 --> 01:18:09,840
i want to get the facts and

2093
01:18:14,149 --> 01:18:10,719
i

2094
01:18:15,910 --> 01:18:14,159
you go

2095
01:18:18,070 --> 01:18:15,920
i'm sorry

2096
01:18:19,590 --> 01:18:18,080
that's great stan i'll let our listeners

2097
01:18:21,830 --> 01:18:19,600
know if you have any upcoming

2098
01:18:23,270 --> 01:18:21,840
conferences or events or or you know

2099
01:18:25,030 --> 01:18:23,280
books or tell them or your books or to

2100
01:18:28,229 --> 01:18:25,040
get your books in your website the thing

2101
01:18:31,510 --> 01:18:28,239
to do is to go to my website uh

2102
01:18:35,270 --> 01:18:33,830
and it lists all my books

2103
01:18:37,590 --> 01:18:35,280
it tells you how to get them and you can

2104
01:18:39,990 --> 01:18:37,600
use paypal and pal and one thing you get

2105
01:18:41,910 --> 01:18:40,000
from me that you don't get from amazon

2106
01:18:44,070 --> 01:18:41,920
is that i autograph all the things i

2107
01:18:45,990 --> 01:18:44,080
send out so

2108
01:18:48,070 --> 01:18:46,000
you know personally

2109
01:18:51,189 --> 01:18:48,080
i don't have an artificial

2110
01:18:55,669 --> 01:18:52,470
but uh

2111
01:18:56,870 --> 01:18:55,679
it also lists my scheduled events i will

2112
01:18:59,750 --> 01:18:56,880
be

2113
01:19:00,550 --> 01:18:59,760
uh i do have some coming up

2114
01:19:02,390 --> 01:19:00,560
uh

2115
01:19:04,149 --> 01:19:02,400
roswell was a great success this year

2116
01:19:05,030 --> 01:19:04,159
incidentally i'm very pleased about that

2117
01:19:06,149 --> 01:19:05,040
but

2118
01:19:09,030 --> 01:19:06,159
i'll be

2119
01:19:10,790 --> 01:19:09,040
uh look at the website uh it'll give you

2120
01:19:11,830 --> 01:19:10,800
dates and

2121
01:19:16,070 --> 01:19:11,840
i

2122
01:19:16,870 --> 01:19:16,080
and

2123
01:19:29,510 --> 01:19:16,880
i

2124
01:19:31,669 --> 01:19:29,520
sure everybody wants to call me

2125
01:19:34,950 --> 01:19:31,679
on the radio well you gave your number

2126
01:19:40,070 --> 01:19:36,870
yeah yeah so

2127
01:19:42,790 --> 01:19:40,080
uh i i am still i i will be going on the

2128
01:19:46,470 --> 01:19:42,800
mufan cruise incidentally

2129
01:19:49,350 --> 01:19:46,480
in early january from tampa to

2130
01:19:53,430 --> 01:19:49,360
uh cozumel and uh down that way about

2131
01:19:54,950 --> 01:19:53,440
five days and several speakers on ufos

2132
01:19:57,430 --> 01:19:54,960
right on how's that

2133
01:19:59,590 --> 01:19:57,440
that's a different event oh yeah yeah

2134
01:20:01,669 --> 01:19:59,600
excellent good for you

2135
01:20:03,189 --> 01:20:01,679
yeah well yeah i'm looking forward to it

2136
01:20:05,030 --> 01:20:03,199
because frankly at that time of year

2137
01:20:07,830 --> 01:20:05,040
it's kind of cold up here

2138
01:20:09,270 --> 01:20:07,840
yeah quite bad

2139
01:20:11,669 --> 01:20:09,280
for sure and i

2140
01:20:13,590 --> 01:20:11,679
just as soon get where it's warmer right

2141
01:20:17,669 --> 01:20:13,600
yeah i hear you there

2142
01:20:20,310 --> 01:20:17,679
so i'm still going strong i'm

2143
01:20:23,189 --> 01:20:20,320
i don't have a another book on the

2144
01:20:25,430 --> 01:20:23,199
on in my typewriter but the last one

2145
01:20:27,669 --> 01:20:25,440
came out in september it was fact

2146
01:20:30,310 --> 01:20:27,679
fiction and flying saucers

2147
01:20:32,790 --> 01:20:30,320
with kathleen martin betty hill oh yeah

2148
01:20:35,030 --> 01:20:32,800
right right and we have i have specials

2149
01:20:36,950 --> 01:20:35,040
that you'll see on the website uh

2150
01:20:38,870 --> 01:20:36,960
our book captured the betty and barney

2151
01:20:41,110 --> 01:20:38,880
hill ufo experience

2152
01:20:43,669 --> 01:20:41,120
and another book that fits in this

2153
01:20:45,990 --> 01:20:43,679
discussion science was wrong

2154
01:20:47,990 --> 01:20:46,000
14 chapters we each did seven each

2155
01:20:49,990 --> 01:20:48,000
stimulated by some very smart person

2156
01:20:52,550 --> 01:20:50,000
saying something stupid

2157
01:20:54,709 --> 01:20:52,560
uh i'm absolutely certain man will never

2158
01:20:56,229 --> 01:20:54,719
fly any distance in a vehicle said simon

2159
01:20:58,070 --> 01:20:56,239
newcombe the great astronomer in the

2160
01:20:59,750 --> 01:20:58,080
united states will never break the sound

2161
01:21:01,990 --> 01:20:59,760
barrier

2162
01:21:03,669 --> 01:21:02,000
oh yeah oh space travel is utter build

2163
01:21:09,030 --> 01:21:03,679
said the british astronomer royal in

2164
01:21:12,070 --> 01:21:10,550
and you know

2165
01:21:13,910 --> 01:21:12,080
there's something to be learned there's

2166
01:21:14,790 --> 01:21:13,920
a price to pay for paying attention to

2167
01:21:17,030 --> 01:21:14,800
people who don't know what they're

2168
01:21:20,149 --> 01:21:17,040
talking about uh

2169
01:21:21,110 --> 01:21:20,159
people who died of smallpox because

2170
01:21:23,830 --> 01:21:21,120
well

2171
01:21:24,790 --> 01:21:23,840
vaccination won't do any good

2172
01:21:26,790 --> 01:21:24,800
sure

2173
01:21:29,030 --> 01:21:26,800
you know right so

2174
01:21:31,270 --> 01:21:29,040
you got to be real careful that people

2175
01:21:32,790 --> 01:21:31,280
are dealing with a straight dick

2176
01:21:34,709 --> 01:21:32,800
and not just their own

2177
01:21:36,950 --> 01:21:34,719
if i don't know it doesn't exist you

2178
01:21:37,830 --> 01:21:36,960
know kind of attitude right

2179
01:21:39,110 --> 01:21:37,840
so

2180
01:21:40,550 --> 01:21:39,120
uh

2181
01:21:41,990 --> 01:21:40,560
there are lessons to be learned that's

2182
01:21:43,590 --> 01:21:42,000
that's why that book and then of course

2183
01:21:47,189 --> 01:21:43,600
there's my book crash at corona the

2184
01:21:48,550 --> 01:21:47,199
definitive study of the roswell incident

2185
01:21:50,709 --> 01:21:48,560
and uh

2186
01:21:53,030 --> 01:21:50,719
oh flying saucers and science which

2187
01:21:55,430 --> 01:21:53,040
covers the waterfront

2188
01:21:57,669 --> 01:21:55,440
and i got a third one out there can oh

2189
01:22:01,430 --> 01:21:57,679
top secret magic yes the story of the

2190
01:22:04,950 --> 01:22:02,870
you know

2191
01:22:05,750 --> 01:22:04,960
there's a lot of data out there

2192
01:22:07,669 --> 01:22:05,760
and

2193
01:22:11,030 --> 01:22:07,679
i was looking i i noticed in the top

2194
01:22:12,790 --> 01:22:11,040
secret metric i listed 10 phd theses

2195
01:22:15,990 --> 01:22:12,800
on ufos

2196
01:22:16,950 --> 01:22:16,000
and i've never seen that list in a book

2197
01:22:18,390 --> 01:22:16,960
uh

2198
01:22:20,149 --> 01:22:18,400
you know for people who say well there

2199
01:22:22,310 --> 01:22:20,159
isn't any data

2200
01:22:26,070 --> 01:22:22,320
well check it out folks there's a lot of

2201
01:22:28,709 --> 01:22:26,080
data right yeah a good point

2202
01:22:31,910 --> 01:22:28,719
so you know and i yeah i i always make

2203
01:22:33,669 --> 01:22:31,920
comments about uh astronomers and that

2204
01:22:35,669 --> 01:22:33,679
city stands for silly effort to

2205
01:22:37,430 --> 01:22:35,679
investigate i was waiting for that one

2206
01:22:39,669 --> 01:22:37,440
yeah

2207
01:22:41,910 --> 01:22:39,679
they have demonstrated their ignorance

2208
01:22:44,070 --> 01:22:41,920
when you give pronouncements without

2209
01:22:45,430 --> 01:22:44,080
having facts to back them up

2210
01:22:47,990 --> 01:22:45,440
i mean they don't know anything about

2211
01:22:49,910 --> 01:22:48,000
government security generally that

2212
01:22:51,350 --> 01:22:49,920
governments can't keep secrets they

2213
01:22:52,709 --> 01:22:51,360
don't know anything about interstellar

2214
01:22:55,270 --> 01:22:52,719
travel

2215
01:22:57,590 --> 01:22:55,280
i've worked on cancer more government

2216
01:23:00,229 --> 01:22:57,600
canceled programs than you could take a

2217
01:23:02,390 --> 01:23:00,239
stick at but uh and you know there's

2218
01:23:04,229 --> 01:23:02,400
another part of that astronomers don't

2219
01:23:05,830 --> 01:23:04,239
think big the universe is big but they

2220
01:23:08,070 --> 01:23:05,840
don't think big but

2221
01:23:10,310 --> 01:23:08,080
one example of that

2222
01:23:12,149 --> 01:23:10,320
is that they don't realize the size of

2223
01:23:13,910 --> 01:23:12,159
the budgets when i was working on

2224
01:23:15,750 --> 01:23:13,920
nuclear airplanes

2225
01:23:17,590 --> 01:23:15,760
general electric aircraft nuclear

2226
01:23:19,510 --> 01:23:17,600
propulsion department

2227
01:23:20,870 --> 01:23:19,520
it wasn't a black project that was the

2228
01:23:25,270 --> 01:23:20,880
name on the door

2229
01:23:29,270 --> 01:23:25,280
between 56 and 59 our budget in 1958

2230
01:23:32,550 --> 01:23:29,280
was 100 million dollars

2231
01:23:34,470 --> 01:23:32,560
we employed 3 400 people of whom 100

2232
01:23:36,310 --> 01:23:34,480
were engineers and scientists

2233
01:23:38,070 --> 01:23:36,320
we're not talking about six professors

2234
01:23:39,750 --> 01:23:38,080
and 20 grad students

2235
01:23:41,430 --> 01:23:39,760
right

2236
01:23:43,990 --> 01:23:41,440
programs cost money

2237
01:23:45,669 --> 01:23:44,000
uh you know like it or not

2238
01:23:47,189 --> 01:23:45,679
you want to build something

2239
01:23:49,350 --> 01:23:47,199
it's going to cost a lot of dough would

2240
01:23:51,189 --> 01:23:49,360
you say that aircraft carrier

2241
01:23:54,149 --> 01:23:51,199
13 billion

2242
01:23:56,070 --> 01:23:54,159
wow yeah imagine if you had that for

2243
01:23:59,189 --> 01:23:56,080
your research

2244
01:24:00,709 --> 01:23:59,199
yeah yeah you get the idea that what i'm

2245
01:24:02,870 --> 01:24:00,719
saying is if you want to get something

2246
01:24:04,310 --> 01:24:02,880
done it's going to cost you

2247
01:24:06,790 --> 01:24:04,320
and i'm not saying governments don't

2248
01:24:08,310 --> 01:24:06,800
waste money but i'm saying when they put

2249
01:24:12,070 --> 01:24:08,320
their mind to it they can get a lot of

2250
01:24:13,990 --> 01:24:12,080
accomplishment there too

2251
01:24:17,270 --> 01:24:14,000
and a lot of times the academic

2252
01:24:19,270 --> 01:24:17,280
community knows nothing about it

2253
01:24:21,510 --> 01:24:19,280
that that's what bugs me they think

2254
01:24:24,070 --> 01:24:21,520
research is only what's done in academia

2255
01:24:27,270 --> 01:24:24,080
sorry right right right right right not

2256
01:24:28,870 --> 01:24:27,280
so right and you know i

2257
01:24:30,709 --> 01:24:28,880
people think you're always looking for a

2258
01:24:33,590 --> 01:24:30,719
fight friedman well

2259
01:24:36,950 --> 01:24:33,600
700 plus lectures and i've only had 11

2260
01:24:38,229 --> 01:24:36,960
hecklers and two of them were drunk

2261
01:24:39,750 --> 01:24:38,239
and you'll get that man if you talk

2262
01:24:42,149 --> 01:24:39,760
about sports religion politics

2263
01:24:44,470 --> 01:24:42,159
absolutely absolutely you are great

2264
01:24:47,110 --> 01:24:44,480
that's exactly right so

2265
01:24:48,070 --> 01:24:47,120
it's not surprising and the thing is i

2266
01:24:49,270 --> 01:24:48,080
find

2267
01:24:51,990 --> 01:24:49,280
uh

2268
01:24:54,550 --> 01:24:52,000
most people are respectful responsive

2269
01:24:56,950 --> 01:24:54,560
sensible oh i hadn't the usual response

2270
01:24:59,110 --> 01:24:56,960
when you refute their argument is oh i

2271
01:25:01,750 --> 01:24:59,120
hadn't thought of it that way

2272
01:25:04,229 --> 01:25:01,760
well okay why should you i've spent a

2273
01:25:05,270 --> 01:25:04,239
lot half a lifetime

2274
01:25:07,350 --> 01:25:05,280
yeah

2275
01:25:09,189 --> 01:25:07,360
thinking about these things

2276
01:25:11,350 --> 01:25:09,199
so of course and when you're on the

2277
01:25:12,550 --> 01:25:11,360
stage after a lecture you can't say i'll

2278
01:25:13,830 --> 01:25:12,560
give you the answer that question

2279
01:25:15,990 --> 01:25:13,840
tomorrow

2280
01:25:17,110 --> 01:25:16,000
right you have to have be ready for it

2281
01:25:18,870 --> 01:25:17,120
now

2282
01:25:20,870 --> 01:25:18,880
right and so

2283
01:25:21,910 --> 01:25:20,880
the audience appreciates that keep your

2284
01:25:25,590 --> 01:25:21,920
cool

2285
01:25:28,390 --> 01:25:25,600
right and uh they'll take care of the uh

2286
01:25:29,350 --> 01:25:28,400
the nasty noisy negatives

2287
01:25:30,310 --> 01:25:29,360
right

2288
01:25:32,950 --> 01:25:30,320
it it

2289
01:25:35,430 --> 01:25:32,960
it's we're talking human nature here

2290
01:25:37,750 --> 01:25:35,440
if a person has taken a stand

2291
01:25:39,669 --> 01:25:37,760
strong stand publicly

2292
01:25:42,470 --> 01:25:39,679
and is in total error he doesn't want to

2293
01:25:45,030 --> 01:25:42,480
admit that really if he can avoid it

2294
01:25:46,629 --> 01:25:45,040
you know that's human nature

2295
01:25:48,709 --> 01:25:46,639
sure

2296
01:25:51,189 --> 01:25:48,719
so and also

2297
01:25:52,870 --> 01:25:51,199
there are other forces at work the

2298
01:25:54,950 --> 01:25:52,880
religious forces

2299
01:25:58,310 --> 01:25:54,960
the political one

2300
01:26:01,030 --> 01:25:58,320
uh you know you hear some of that with

2301
01:26:02,709 --> 01:26:01,040
president trump now uh

2302
01:26:03,990 --> 01:26:02,719
people pointing out

2303
01:26:05,830 --> 01:26:04,000
you know there's a lot of things that

2304
01:26:06,629 --> 01:26:05,840
aren't true that are being said

2305
01:26:09,270 --> 01:26:06,639
sure

2306
01:26:10,149 --> 01:26:09,280
yep that's a fact so

2307
01:26:12,550 --> 01:26:10,159
you know

2308
01:26:14,390 --> 01:26:12,560
there's no the fact checkers aren't

2309
01:26:18,149 --> 01:26:14,400
always working on what government guys

2310
01:26:23,430 --> 01:26:20,709
well stan thanks for coming on it's it's

2311
01:26:25,030 --> 01:26:23,440
been it's been amazing and uh i really

2312
01:26:26,550 --> 01:26:25,040
appreciate what you do for the field and

2313
01:26:28,550 --> 01:26:26,560
you're keeping it real and you're still

2314
01:26:30,149 --> 01:26:28,560
going and it's it's a great thing stan

2315
01:26:32,709 --> 01:26:30,159
thanks for coming on the show and we'll

2316
01:26:33,910 --> 01:26:32,719
have you back and maybe maybe early next

2317
01:26:34,830 --> 01:26:33,920
year sometime if you wouldn't mind

2318
01:26:39,430 --> 01:26:34,840
coming back

2319
01:26:42,470 --> 01:26:39,440
on why not oh i enjoy you know i grew up

2320
01:26:47,270 --> 01:26:42,480
with radio guys and i'll be 83 next week

2321
01:26:52,709 --> 01:26:49,750
i love it that's great oh yeah keep it

2322
01:26:54,870 --> 01:26:52,719
up you betcha thank you have fun guys

2323
01:26:56,790 --> 01:26:54,880
yes hey youtube have fun thank you very

2324
01:26:59,750 --> 01:26:56,800
much thank you all right

2325
01:27:05,430 --> 01:27:02,229
well there you go ken the legend himself

2326
01:27:07,510 --> 01:27:05,440
the uh the king of ufology

2327
01:27:09,990 --> 01:27:07,520
stan friedman he's uh he's got a great

2328
01:27:12,229 --> 01:27:10,000
sense of humor and uh wow he's a wealth

2329
01:27:14,550 --> 01:27:12,239
of information he definitely is and we

2330
01:27:16,390 --> 01:27:14,560
gave you all some bonus coverage tonight

2331
01:27:17,750 --> 01:27:16,400
you know because i'm the boss and we

2332
01:27:19,750 --> 01:27:17,760
just kind of did that well thanks for

2333
01:27:21,270 --> 01:27:19,760
everybody for coming on we're working on

2334
01:27:23,270 --> 01:27:21,280
a few

2335
01:27:25,189 --> 01:27:23,280
guests here before we hit the john ford

2336
01:27:27,910 --> 01:27:25,199
ufo nightmare which the next episode

2337
01:27:29,430 --> 01:27:27,920
would be august 13th 9 pm eastern but

2338
01:27:31,030 --> 01:27:29,440
hang in there everybody we'll work on

2339
01:27:33,189 --> 01:27:31,040
some new guests if you have suggestions

2340
01:27:35,750 --> 01:27:33,199
for guests you can always send them to

2341
01:27:37,590 --> 01:27:35,760
payingradio gmail.com we'll definitely

2342
01:27:39,669 --> 01:27:37,600
go through it and uh everybody have a

2343
01:27:41,189 --> 01:27:39,679
great week and don't forget to hang your

2344
01:27:43,430 --> 01:27:41,199
head and

2345
01:27:45,270 --> 01:27:43,440
keep at least one eye to the sky good

2346
01:27:46,629 --> 01:27:45,280
night everybody good night thanks for

2347
01:27:49,189 --> 01:27:46,639
listening

2348
01:27:52,149 --> 01:27:49,199
okay kevin for the grand prize of one

2349
01:27:54,229 --> 01:27:52,159
million dollars what color is the white